So frustrated... may I vent?


#1

So 8 days ago my V2 hub just up and died…I had been loving ST. 41 “things” a ton of automatons, Yeah, occasionally there would be a hiccup but nothing major. So ST sends me a new hub. Because of the holiday it did not get here till Thursday afternoon. I get started with the slow painful process… got about half my “things” loaded. Go to bed. Get up the next morning and pick up my phone. I had started the process with my phone, and then switched to my tablet. Well, the phone still had the initial screen up for setting up. I don’t know how I did it, and I take full responsibility for it, but I lost everything I had done the night before closing down the app. So, I start again. I get about half way through yesterday and I decide to setup my first automation. Smart Lighting. It won’t load. I setup an automation, I get the message it is done. I go back and look, and I have no apps, did that 4 times before it finally loaded. Then it won’t work anyway. I get on line Chat with ST yesterday… FOR FOUR HOURS. Things quit pairing, automatons would not fire. We reset, we removed batteries, we moved the hub… Finally after 4 hours, things seem to start working like they should… I get off chat, go back to loading things, and setting up automatons. Get up this morning, not one single thing responds to the app, not one single automation fired. Now it is Saturday and ST support is closed. If I had not had a hub that really worked great, I would be packing this crap up and returning it… so frustrated. Thank-you for letting me vent.


#2

Wow. :scream: I’m really sorry you’re going through that.

The only thing I can think of that fits the picture you’re describing is some serious local interference that comes and goes.

You probably already checked this, but when you set up the hub, is it at least 10 feet from your router and any Wi-Fi boosters?

Beyond that, support will probably have to help you track down the issues.

Again, I’m really sorry you’re dealing with this. One of the problems with moving a mature set up is that there are so many different pieces to it. When you start out altogether new, you typically just working with one or two devices and then one or two Routines. You add incrementally. But of course when you are rebuilding a large system that you already had working, you want to get it all done at once. In a weird way your previous success makes you more vulnerable the next time.


#3

Support had me move the hub yesterday as part of painful process. I pulled the batteries and power this morning…went back to working for about an hour…back to nothing working again…urrrrrr


(Paul) #4

Sorry to step in on this post… i haven’t seen the “10 foot away from the wifi router” recomemdation before. Everyting i have is in the same closet. I get random delays… random settings disappering… etc… i alwasy assumed it was just that way on Android. Moving the hub may mot be easy but maybe i should if it could help? Do most folllow this?

Thanks


#5

RIt’s a standard recommendation. One of those “can’t hurt, might help” things. Same with being in an enclosed cabinet. If it’s a metal cabinet or one of those red lacquer Chinese cabinets (red lacquer has iron in it) then getting it out into the open air can help as well.

The most likely interference is between zigbee and Wi-Fi. But you can get bleed over noise between any frequencies if they’re really strong and close together, like a microwave causing Netflix to buffer. :wink:

In general, you want the home automation hub centrally located in your house (both vertically and horizontally) and at least 10 feet away from any other RF transmitter, but particularly Wi-Fi.

If you have it closer and everything is working great, don’t worry about it. But if you are having problems with lost messages or lag, then adding space may help.


(Paul) #6

Ok… Thanks JD. I’ll try it today and see what happens.

Thanks


#7

If you’re moving the router, you don’t need to do anything with smart things.

If you’re moving the smart things hub, you need to get all the individual devices to update their neighbor tables as they may be a different distance from the hub than previously.

This requires two steps, one for Zigbee and one for zwave.

For Zigbee, take the hub off power, including taking out any batteries, and leave it off power for at least 15 minutes while all your other zigbee devices are still on power. This will cause the other devices to go into panic mode, and they will rebuild their neighbor tables after the hub comes back online.

For Z wave, run the " zwave repair" utility.

Note that it can take a while for the individual devices to all complete this task even after the hub says it has finished. So you may not see the full results until the next day.


(Paul) #8

I didn’t think about moving the router…duh… :slight_smile: But i do like the idea of getting it out of the closet. I moved it just to see if it helps any.
As you can see it was tucked away right next to the router. I’ll see how it goes and when i find a new home for the hub i’ll do the zwave and zigbee repairs.
Moved from here…

To here


#9

Even if you had everything else turned off, that amount of metal surrounding it would’ve probably lost the messages.

It will be much happier out in the open. :wink:

You might still move it a few feet away from the echo, though.


#10

Op here…since no support on the weekend I decided to try moving it again…did the battery removal for 15 minutes as part of the process. Then did a z wave repair…ummmm got the following message:. Network repair for device (17) failed to update route…failed to update mesh info…so what does that mean and how do I figure out what is device 17? Thanks


#11

**[quote=“jgirvine, post:10, topic:49553, full:true”]
Op here…since no support on the weekend I decided to try moving it again…did the battery removal for 15 minutes as part of the process. Then did a z wave repair…ummmm got the following message:. Network repair for device (17) failed to update route…failed to update mesh info…so what does that mean and how do I figure out what is device 17? Thanks
[/quote]

You have a ghost device-- that could be causing a lot of the problems you’re seeing. Try this, in particular Ahndee’s suggestions


(Jason "The Enabler" as deemed so by @Smart) #12

Just my .02 and it may not be applicable in any way…

But, many homes kitchens tend to be in a fairly centralized location.

Do your cabinets go to the ceiling? Is there an electrical supply near by? Can you route the lab cable there?

The top of the cabinet out a top shelf in the cabinet can be a couple of good locations to put a hub.


#13

Personally, I don’t generally put hubs in kitchens, basement, or garages, because all three tend to have multiple large metal objects which can distort signal. Also being within 15 feet of the microwave is always going to lead to lost signal whenever the microwave is running.

I’d rather see it in a central hall closet or the living room or centrally located Den or bedroom.

But you can always try it and see what happens. :sunglasses:


(Beckwith) #14

My anecdotal testing showed no impact from microwave but surprisingly toggling florescent lamp on/off caused issues. This motivated me to replace them with LED.


#15

Yeah, fluorescent EMI is a thing. And it’s worse with the newer ones. You can reduce it with proper installation, but you may not be able to get rid of it altogether.

Modern electronic ballasts typically operate in the 20 KHz to 60 KHz range and may cause interference with communication equipment that did not occur with traditional electromagnetic 60Hz ballasts.

Electromagnetic Interference (EMI) can cause static on radio communications or interfere with the operation of any electronic device especially wireless communication devices.

Types of EMI
Conducted EMI is injected back into the power system through the ballasts conductors. This type of EMI may cause interference with devices on the same electrical distribution network. Radiated EMI is radiated into the air by the fluorescent lamp, ballast, conductors, or ungrounded fixture.


(Brian) #16

Wow! That “from here” picture looks like a purposeful design to NOT allow the hub to communicate to anything. Only putting it in a safe would be worse than that. Wise idea to move it, and yes I would definitely move it away from the echo as well. It’s the brain of your house, give it the resources it needs to operate. :slight_smile:


(Paul) #17

I’ve moved it about two feet away from the echo. Does seem to be reacting to motion faster. I wouldnt say a blazzing improvement but i did notice the different. Well worth the effort to install a new network outline.

Sorry again for hajacking the thread… I always read JDs posts. Always great info. Just like this time.

Thanks


(Michael Hess) #18

Bet moving your router more into the open would improve your general wifi around the house as well. Just remember, because it says wireless doesn’t mean you should put it anywhere! :slight_smile: