Matter question

have you tried this example? my device fails to pair with the error code.

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I have seen that reported on other forums as well. Other Matter apps work with the example device; the Smartthings app does not. :thinking: I’ll admit, I assumed smartthings just wasn’t fully ready yet.

@Automated_House

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What is the Error code? Could you share more information? Screen recording works as well!

  1. iOS: Hopefully, in the near future! (Sorry for the generic answer)
  2. If a device is upgraded to Matter-compatible software, you’d need to add the device after the firmware update. If you are thinking about a Zigbee device getting Matter firmware, in that case, I anticipate that you will need to factory reset the device and go through the add process again. The user will lose connectivity with that Zigbee device, and the user will need to manually remove it.
  3. Yes it is, you have the Thread Network Info available to you (PAN ID, Network Key, Network Name, Channel), you can use that info to add any Thread device to Hub’s Thread Network
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Could you share any other information about the other Matter Apps working with the example device?

We’d be happy to help anyone with issues related to Matter onboarding.

sounds like you haven’t tried. I’ll make a recording tomorrow

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On the video I tried to connect a virtual Matter lightbulb from the official Matter Github repository.

Smartthings failed with two error codes.

At the same time, Google Home can pair the device and share it with Apple’s Homekit.

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Here a matter certified device I suppose I’d like to have on SmartThings
It’s the light sensor bit I’d like to be able to use in routines, currently dusk to dawn even with a offset isn’t good enough for me, especially on very overcast winter afternoons .

That’s the new thread sensor. It’s not even scheduled to release until “early 2023.” that’s typical, by the way. Usually it takes 3 to 6 months for a new device to move from certification to sold at retail, whether it’s Zigbee, Z wave, or now Matter.

If everything goes as planned, once it is available, it should just work out of the box with smartthings as long as you have a Thread border router. So that’s the good news. But we will have to wait and see exactly what features it has in that integration. :thinking:

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Philips Hue has had its Matter firmware out in Beta since monday. https://developers.meethue.com

I have paired my hue bridge to Apple Home successfully with Matter and brought a dozen non-hue zigbee devices into Apple Home which were previously locked out.

My Smartthings was able to pair with a Matter dev board from espressif through Home Asst.'s Matter workshop back in June without any problems.

I have not been able to pair my Smartthings to Hue Bridge via Matter yet. It just sits at Preparing for a few minutes before erroring out. I’ve set the hub to pairing mode directly as well as via the Apple Home app but neither method seems to get ST to talk to Hue successfully via Matter.

If you are trying to bring the smartthings hub into another matter capable app, my understanding is that will never happen. Smartthings has said publicly that their hubs will not be “matter Bridges” which is what you need for integration out.

Instead, smartthings has opted for one-way matter compatibility in. Its hubs will be “matter controllers” which means you can add matter compatible devices from other companies to your smartthings account.

So there are different possible configurations. It is up to each device manufacturer as far as which of these configurations they choose to use for a hub.

  1. one-way integration out. This is how the Hue hub will work. You can add it to other matter capable apps, such as Apple home or smartthings, but you cannot bring matter capable devices from other companies in to the hue app using only matter. (you can still add some zigbee devices like INNR and Gledopto to Hue.)

  2. one-way integration in. This is how the smartthings hub will work. You can add other matter capable devices to Smart things, but you cannot add the smartthings hub to other companies’ matter capable apps.

  3. two way integration. So far the only company I have seen which has promised this configuration is IKEA with their new dirigera hub, which will be both a matter controller and a matter bridge. But it’s going to take them a few months to get there. You can buy the hub now, but it’s going to take a software update before it will act as a matter bridge. Hopefully they will get there, it’s just not there yet.

So…

If everything was working correctly, you would be able to add a hue hub to your smartthings set up using matter, but you would not be able to add a smartthings hub to the hue app, or to the Apple Home app using matter. You will still need homebridge to get smartthings devices into the Apple home app.

All of that said, that just describes how it’s supposed to work.

There have been reports both in this forum and elsewhere (including in this thread) That so far people cannot add even the example simulated devices to Smartthings using matter. Staff are supposed to be looking into it.

So I’m not quite sure exactly how you were trying to do it, but there’s no way at the present time to get smartthings hub and its attached devices into Apple home except through homebridge. matter isn’t adding any functionality there. :disappointed_relieved:

More discussion in detail in the following thread:

Matter - smart home connectivity standard (formerly Project CHIP)

Ooops, I guess I wasn’t as clear as I meant to be. Everything seems to think it can auto correct us, but it just makes a bigger mess. I have my Hue bridge with devices that I am trying to pair to SmartThings. Matter Accessories coming from Hue INTO SmartThings.

Thank you for the explanation of the Smartthings matter stance. That is why I moved devices from the Hub to Hue’s bridge. I can get them in Alexa, and Google eventually with Matter, but also Apple Home, (not Homekit) with the new Hue Matter bridge firmware. With Matter, I can add my devices to any system I want, apple, ST or even HAH.

I was able to take my little dev board from Home Assist and add it to Apple so far as a Matter Accessory. I even added it to Smart Things. The Hue matter bridge though won’t go into ST though.

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Interesting, if frustrating. At this point everything is so new it’s hard to say what’s going on. :thinking:

I have no idea what will happen when a device like Hue has both a nonMatter edge driver integration and a matter edge driver integration.

Tagging @Automated_House , who has been following all of this pretty closely.

Looks Like the eve motion sensor is now matter certified

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certified or upgraded and equipped? Getting the cert and releasing it is another. For Example Hue is certified but released as beta so far. Once its Released, I’ll go buy at least one Hue-Priced matter motion sensor or smart plug. [quote=“Declankh, post:35, topic:250645, full:true”]
Looks Like the eve motion sensor is now matter certified

[/quote]

I’m sure you already know this next bit, but for other readers who don’t and are following the conversation…

Matter Certification is Just One Step in a Multistep Release Process

Certification is just one step in the manufacturing process.

For a brand new product, it’s typically 3 to 6 months from protocol certification until it’s available to buy at retail. There are just a lot of steps along the way.

If it’s an existing product just getting a firmware update without changing the transmission specs it goes much faster, sometimes on the same day.

Timeline for Eve Products

In the specific case of the Eve motion sensor, the company has already announced the date for the firmware updates:

The latest models of Eve Energy, Eve Door & Window and Eve Motion have already completed Matter certification. Starting December 12, 2022, iPhone users can upgrade those devices for free in the Eve app to grant every family member local and direct access from their preferred voice assistant or smartphone.

So it will be another month or so yet for those.

@Declankh @Automated_House

Indeed. Eve is one company, Wiz is another company that is awaiting a boon once they get their Matter Certification and able to release updates for existing products. Looking at Wiz’s product offerings, once they get Matter-fied could be a great addition and way to start a new smart home.

This leads to the question, can Smartthings operate without an actual ST hub? Can the Smart Things app pair to matter devices directly without the local ST bridge.

Sure, and indeed that’s how they expect the vast majority of their customers to use Matter. (Remember that at this point probably over 90% of ST customers DON’T have an st/Aeotec hub: they have a Samsung phone, smart tv, or smart appliance.)

Matter devices using WiFi will work out of the box. To use Thread devices, you’d have to have at least one thread border router in the home, but since both Alexa and Google Home will have some models that will do this, most people interested in home automation will already have one.

You can already set up a nice SmartThings smart home in a hub free configuration: smart tv, ring or Arlo cameras, hue hub, Lutron or WiFi lighting, Meross or TPLink Kasa smart plugs, WiFi bridge lock from Yale or Schlage, even Shelly sensors and relays if you want. Nest or Ecobee thermostat. Matter just brings more candidate devices in the existing categories. And hopefully more local operation, although the ST app still requires a cloud connection whether you have a hub or not.

Thats the benefit of Matter, we can use Apple Home or other apps when we want total local control to appease our paranoia and ST or other cloud-based controllers for times not.

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Understood, but we can only use matter locally if the app we have chosen runs locally.

Apple’s Home app and IKEA’s Dirigera app can run locally.

Smartthings app always requires an active cloud connection, with or without matter. And since smartthings is not going to allow, its hub to be added to the apps that do run locally (it’s not a “matter bridge”), it continues to be a platform with a significant cloud component.

My own hope is that market forces may cause them to reconsider this architecture in a year or so, but that’s just a personal hope. For now, the smartthings matter integration is strictly one way in.

Officially, even with edge, the ST app still goes through the cloud. It’s in the top right of this official picture.

So anyway, sure, if you have Matter devices that can be connected to both apps at the same time, your suggestion would work well. In fact, I already do that, as do a number of other community members, by getting devices that work with both Apple HomeKit and smartthings. For example, my Meross smart plugs have a cloud to cloud integration to Smartthings, but are local to HomeKit.

I expect there will be more devices with these options as matter comes on the market.

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