https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/GettingStarted?NextQID=203&Url=%23%26panel1-6#crnt
Is this the right channel for a regulator complaint? I mean, certainly itâs fraud to continue to take money for a âhome automationâ product that canât turn a light on and off on a schedule, and continues to fail to do so for months and years?
Not sure the techs have been through my stuff several times. âwe updated your apps let us know if you still have problemsâ
Guess I need to update the apps several times a day.
And yes $100 ST and the rest on what they claim to be compatible. In other words if you buy these items they will work with our product. But they donât because their product doesnât.
What would you say when a mechanic tells you these brake pads will make you stop faster so you pay to have them installed and find out it makes no difference because the calipers are faulty.
I think this is a valid basis for claiming damages.
The right way to proceed is probably to send ST a bill for your devices which donât work with ST as advertised. When they refuse to pay it, sue in small claims. Or if youâre really ambitious, start a class action.
I donât think so. Iâm not a lawyer, but FAIK, if you (or someone else) were injured due to product malfunction, then you might have a case. Otherwise, youâll be advised to return it, if you still can, send it for warranty service or discontinue using it.
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Physical injury is not the only type of damages for which you can seek compensation. Any type of demonstrable monetary loss is fair game. As for returning, if youâve been misled into believing âa fix is on the wayâ, itâs more than reasonable to claim the company is responsible for the loss when you didnât make a return.
I also donât think a âterms of serviceâ can void fundamental consumer rights against deceptive business practices.
Sure, you can always file a small claim, even if only for $100, plus throw a few hundred dollars for âlost timeâ. Most small claims are settled out of court because itâs cheaper for the company to pay your claim than send a lawyer to the court at $500 hourly rate. 
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Iâm sure Iâve said this before:
In this great country, a lawsuit is always possible; but only the lawyers win. If some firm that specializes in consumer protection smell a big class action, they might take the case, but fighting against Samsungâs legal resources would be extremely costly. Most of the net settlement (not judgement ⌠it would never make it in front of a judge); would go towards the firmâs contingency fees and direct expenses. The consumer portion of the settlement would probably be an option for each to fill out a lengthy claim for a coupon for all customers for a free upgrade to the next hub, or 50% off a light switch⌠Iâm not kidding.
Small claims court is a truly wonderful thing. One of the final remaining bulwarks against the big guy running over the little guy because nobody has the power or financial incentives to stop them.
It should be used responsibly, to be sure. IMO, if someone dropped a significant amount of money on devices based on the ST marketing claims, and find those devices unusable over a period of months and years, they have a legitimate claim to be made whole for those losses as a consequence of deceptive marketing.
Go for it.
The drawback to the small claims solution is that it really doesnât do much to incentivize remediation at the vendor, as thereâs unlikely to be any significant punitive damages threat.
True.
But one could imagine that a judgment posted on Twitter, Amazon reviews, and sent to tech media and elsewhere would not be without consequence.
I most certainly can imagine no serious âconsequenceâ.
I believe that, I dunno, ATT Wireless, banks, and hundreds, thousands of judgements in favor of the consumer have been granted. And the majority of those companies are doing just fine.
You canât fight corporations and really âwinâ anything. And, frankly, this is very basic case of caveat emptor here: There are thousands of products that donât work as marketed and the small claims courts are not flooded. It is âright and fairâ, perhaps not ⌠but it is reality.
And: Thereâs nothing stopping you from spending as much effort as you want to get a judgement in your favor, or even, just publishing your negative experience as widely as you can (Twitter, Amazon reviews, tech media). There are already plenty of negative reviews on Amazon, and folks continue to buy anyway.
But the media is pretty soft on SmartThings:
Isnât that the truth. However, thatâs a little different because mobile service is a borderline essential service to a broad demographic, with few alternatives. Home automation is a luxury product that very few people really need. Demand will be a stronger function of perception.
If you settle, thereâs no judgment, and settlement is not an admission of guilt, as any lawyer will tell you. Besides, your settlement agreement would most likely include a clause preventing you from doing that.
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Youâre making the unfounded assumption that Samsung SmartThings has any interest consumer demand; and/or that they arenât experts at continuing to manipulate that demand and remain competitive regardless of a âlittleâ bad PR.
Samsung has settled consumer lawsuits in the past⌠hereâs a big one for televisions (malfunctioning and price-fixing); and yet, Samsung remains one of the top sellers of TVs:
Right. This is why it would be important to seek a judgment, not a settlement.
But what would you gain other than publicity? If your goal is to recover your losses, settlement is the best choice. Going before the judge is a waste of even more time.
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###Shock
SmartThings doesnât work as advertised??!?!?? My lights donât turn on at sunset? I get false alarms from my sirens? Nest isnât 100% integrated? Hub V2 only runs what locally?
###Denial
Surely Iâve just got a bad device or two, network issues, havenât read all the Forum posts and contacted Support for every issue, right? Thereâs an App/Platform/Cloud/staffing upgrade next week that will fix everything!
###Anger & Guilt â you are here @anderson110
Dammit I spent all this money and Iâve wasted electricity for 8 hours because my lights never turn off at sunrise â my spouse is going to kill me! Wait ⌠Iâll file a lawsuit! Iâll make those negligent corporate deceivers pay!!!
###Despair & Depression
Gosh it takes forever to get a court date. And my house is still dumb, unlike my neighbors that bought Control4.
###Acceptance
I give up. Time to fund the latest Smart Home related Kickstarter and buy some $20 timers and hardwired motion sensors for the lights and pay ADT for a ârealâ security system.
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Nah. I donât need my lights to be automatic or any other HA, and Iâve thrown away far more money on bigger boondoggles. That doesnât make the product as it exists today not a swindle.
There comes a point when a product team crosses a line from good intentions falling short, where I placed ST about 12 months ago, into engaging in fraud when they 1) Fail to update the productâs claims to resemble its reality, OR 2) Continue to accept payment for what they know to be false claims.
In my view, ST has crossed that line by failing to do either of those things. Thatâs enough on the topic for a day.
Thatâs why itâs better to let the government take it on as a fraud case. They have the deep pockets and can go the distance, especially against a large company like Samsung. Nothing gets a companyâs attention more than an agency launching and investigation or filing an injunction.
Sure, we wonât get any restitution out of it. But it may light a fire under their efforts to fix the problem. And thatâs all we really want anyway.