UK Alarm / Security System that is ST Compatible--advice needed (2018 build)


(Pavlos) #1

Good morning,

Does anybody have experience with any alarm system that is compatible or can communicate with ST?

This is for my new house that I am building now and the electrician is asking me what type of wiring he wants me to install for the alarm system. I prefer to have a wired security system (old school) but the brain of my system to be able to communicate with ST. I have seen that in the US, ADT has started a partnership with ST and they sell a compatible system, but does anybody have any solutions for UK/EU?

Thanks for your time.


(ActionTiles.com co-founder Terry @ActionTiles; GitHub: @cosmicpuppy) #2

There are very few options. Hopefully someone will chime in with what works best for them.

If you are installing wiring, though, your interim (or even best!) solution would be to purchase @heythisisnate’s amazing Konnected.io modules. It uses inexpensive hardware to convert the wired sensor outputs to mimic SmartThings sensors, thus enabling Smart Home Monitor and all the rest of SmartThings / WebCoRe / ActionTiles goodness.

SmartThings offers integration of SHM with “Scout” here in the USA for monitored security. I presume they are working on other integrations, but … probably will take a long time.


(Nate Clark) #3

I’m a little biased, but I think the Konnected solution is perfect for you. Check out all the video content on my Kickstarter page: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nateclark/konnected-alarm-panel-revive-your-wired-alarm-syst

The Kickstarter ended just recently but you can still pre-order on my website. You’re at a great advantage being able to wire your home before it is built. All traditional wired sensors work perfectly with Konnected + ST and we have a number of UK customers.

If you require a 3rd-party monitoring service, that might be a little tougher though. I don’t think an integration exists (yet) for the UK.


#4

First, this is the UK category. Please confine your answers to systems which are available and legal to operate there.

@heythisisnate , as a new business owner, I suggest you consult your attorney about issues regarding selling into the UK or even advertising/offering advice to those in the UK with regard to security systems. UK laws/regulations are quite different than the US for both security systems and for advertising. Just as one example, even DIY systems in England are required by law to turn off their sirens after 20 minutes even if the internet is unavailable– selling something which doesn’t meet that requirement but is advertised for security purposes is itself a violation of law. The customers may not know all of the requirements, but the businesses are expected to.

There are a number of other “obvious” features required for UK systems which someone in the US may never have heard of or even considered. So for this particular category, it’s essential to limit discussion to systems approved for use in the UK.

Next… in the UK, you will be fined for false alarms to the police. In the US, this varies from town to town and many towns will give you at least one “just a warning” response, but this is taken much more seriously in the UK. There are a lot of different aspects to it, including whether you are required to register with the “peace for a pound” scheme even if it is just a self monitoring system.

As far as the OP’s original question, hopefully some of the UK members who have investigated these issues like @bobbles will have more to add. I’ve modified the thread title in the hopes of attracting more responses.

@tapion1ives has done a lot of work on an integration between the Yale smartphone alarm system, which is one of the most popular in the UK, and SmartThings. It’s not a full integration, and only the Yale devices can be used to trigger the Yale alarms, but it does give you status information and some alarm/disarm options. It’s definitely worth taking a look at, and you can ask further questions of people in that thread who are using it.

@jelockwood has also been doing research into UK security systems, including wired options, although I don’t know if he has selected one yet. He does have a discussion thread:

@cjcharles is a UK member who has done work on a Visonic integration, but I don’t know if he has written up a project report on it. Still he might have more to add.

@Deleted_Username has something similar set up with Envisalink.

@cobra may also have some additional thoughts.

Also, @Steveuk23 has reported that ADT in the UK is starting a beta for a SmartThings – compatible product, presumably similar to the one that was just released to the US market last month. ADT is one of the largest security system companies in the UK, just as it is in the US, so I would consider this good news. Note, though, that if it is engineered in a fashion similar to the US system it will have its own line of sensors and will not be able to be used with either ADT sensors from other systems or with SmartThings sensors at least as far as alerting the monitoring system. So don’t buy other devices in anticipation of this product, as they may not be compatible.

So there are some options depending on exactly what you want to accomplish, but at the moment nothing that works just out of the box for full SmartThings integration. That’s not necessarily a bad thing: many of us in both the US and the UK are on a completely separate security system and reserve SmartThings just for home automation applications where reliability is less critical. It is less convenient to have two systems, but manageable for most people.

Hopefully some of the UK members who have researched security systems will have more to add. :sunglasses:


(Pavlos) #5

Hey @JDRoberts as always, your posts are very helpful, so thank you once again. By the way, I am posting in the UK & Ireland section because to the best of my knowlege, the systems in the UK are similar to the EU systems, and I have not seen an EU section. I assume this is ok?

@heythisisnate Thank you very much for your reply, I watched your video and your system looks very good. I live in Athens, Greece (EU), which is definitely not as strict as the US or even the UK when it comes to regulations. Will you be selling your product in the EU, or are you sticking to the US market for now?


#6

It’s certainly OK, but security systems are one of those areas where there is quite a bit of local variation as far as what a system is required to do and what products are available. For example, I wouldn’t assume that an ADT/SmartThings integration that was available in the UK would also be available in Greece. So in future, I think it would be helpful if you specify that your home is in Greece. You will probably get better answers.

I know DSC equipment is available in Greece, I’m not sure about other brands. @ktsi was looking into security options there, Including Caddx, I’m not sure what solution was eventually selected.


(Andy - United Kingdom) #7

I cannot recommend anyone using SmartThings in a stand alone security context.

As @JDRoberts has already stated, here in the UK we have restrictions for alarm duration/Police contact etc etc but this is all secondary to the reliance on SmartThings having an internet connection - Whatever the country it’s being used in.

I have a very reliable setup here which uses multiple UPS’ with multiple phone lines and multiple internet connections as I run my internet based business from home and internet connectivity is essential for me and the guys that work for me

BUT… my alarm system is a good old fashioned wired stand alone system which in not internet or even mains power, dependent (about 6-10 hours battery backup under no alarm conditions)

With a little work it was easy to get SmartThings to send a message if the alarm is triggered, which is the only integration which I feel comfortable with.
Using SmartThings for alerts is fine (in my opinion) but anything else is just too dependent upon things like internet access and the SmartThings platform which we cannot control


(Nate Clark) #8

@JDRoberts thanks for the advice regarding UK regulations. Just to be clear, from my perspective Konnected is not a security system. It’s an integration or a “bridge” between wired sensors & signaling devices and SmartThings. In the Konnected setup, SmartThings is the security system because it controls all the logic of the system itself. Using Konnected as a security system in the UK is no different functionally than using SmartThings with wireless Z-wave sensors and sirens – so my assumption is that if ST can sell/market in the UK and provide security-like services, then there should be no problem marketing/selling integrations with that system.

Yes, I can ship anywhere in Europe. It’s available for pre-order now: https://konnected.io


(cjcharles) #10

There is plenty of information on my thread, and even more if you click the link to see things on Github where there are full instructions. If you have any questions ill happily answer and I know Visonic systems are sold in Greece.

Every situation is different so I’ll leave you to decide, but I would agree with @Cobra , if you want an alarm buy an alarm, if you want an ST based product then go for that - they are not the same and serve quite different purposes (an actual alarm system which can be made smart or a smart set of sensors added to ST much cheaper than using zwave kit). I won’t say any more than that!


(Glenn Smith) #11

I was doing some research a while,back about having any old alarm and using the fibaro relays inline to pickup the PIR data and connect to smartthings. Fibaro - Universal Binary Sensor - Does it work with Smart Things

I also looked at a Honeywell Galaxy Flex 20 which supports a programmable relay board which could feed the fibaro relays or the door entry device that has wires you could use tag in to on the post hard wired alarm logic. If you give it a wired internet connection too it has its own app, so there might be an api to,hook in to.


(Meza) #12

I’m in UK, using a wired DSC alarm panel and keypads for the alarm and hooked it and all of the sensors into Smartthings with Envisalink and Alarmserver.

I feel I’ve got the best of both worlds as I wanted to use a ‘real’ alarm, but can also use the sensors for automation in ST and also remote monitor the system.

Don’t trust ST for security on its own, not reliable enough and too few backups.

Bought the panel from Ebay and installed myself.


(Meza) #13

But to answer your original question on wiring… I would go ahead and have your installer run standard 8-core alarm cable to everywhere you may want sensors. Then you can choose which wired system, eg a regular panel or Konnected at a later date.


(John Lockwood) #14

@JDRoberts @SteveUK

Any further news regarding this possible ADT / Smartthings UK product?

For what its worth -

DSC have launched a new range called Iotega which looks interesting - http://www.dsc.com/iotega/ it seems to have Z-Wave support - even on the UK model! They have or will have a fancy LCD panel. It is not clear what level of connectivity they allow via Z-Wave. I shall look further at this.

Honeywell have a new Lyric Home Security system which also has a fancy LCD panel and even supports Apple HomeKit! Sadly this is once more only for the US and not us poor neglected UK. See https://yourhome.honeywell.com/en/products/security-alarm-solutions/lyric-security-and-home-control-system


(Pavlos) #15

Hi @heythisisnate ,

I noticed that you have launched your product to the market, congratulations!

I would like to ask for your advise.

So I am currently looking into buying a new alarm system for my new house and my electrician has already pre-wired the house to be compatible with pretty much any system.

So, I am assuming that I do not need to buy a standard system, only to replace it with your Konnected system right? Do you have any FAQ or guide on what to buy or what is needed in order to install your system on a new house?


(Nate Clark) #16

If your home is already pre-wired, you don’t need anything special or extra. Our Konnected Alarm Panel kit includes everything you need for a basic setup: https://konnected.io/products/konnected-alarm-panel-wired-alarm-system-conversion-kit

This assumes that you already have pre-wired with sensors installed in the doors/windows and motion sensors if desired. If not, then you will need to buy and install the standard alarm system sensors. Konnected is also compatible with all 12V DC sirens/strobes that are common for residential burglar alarms.

If you choose to optionally install wall-mounted tablets where your keypad(s) normally would be, you will also need one 12V to 5V USB converter for each tablet. if you plan to have more than one tablet, we strongly recommend a separate power supply to run power to the tablets separate from the Konnected panel.

I hope this helps. Don’t hesitate to reach out to us at help@konnected.io if you have specific questions.


(Pavlos) #17

Thank you @heythisisnate

Have you solved the issue with the “delay exit” ?


(Nate Clark) #18

Hah. I didn’t know this was an issue that I was responsible for solving.


(ActionTiles.com co-founder Terry @ActionTiles; GitHub: @cosmicpuppy) #19

You’re also on the hook for solving Climate Change and North Korean de-nuclearization. :grimacing:


(Pavlos) #20

Hehe yes, sorry, that should not have been directed to you :wink:

Meantime, do you have any guide or article on how to install the Konnect without replacing my existing keypad? Ideally I would like to use both in parallel.

Thanks.


(Nate Clark) #21

Just wait a couple weeks for our new product that’s designed for this. The Konnected Alarm Panel cannot be run in parallel.