@yvesracine
That’s unfortunate. It seems like an easy win-win scenario for everybody. Is there a certain contact where we can start making requests to them? I feel like they will have to come to some solution soon if they continue to advertise the EcoBee3.
Hi, you can try @ben, he’s the highest ranking offcial that I know at ST 
I absolutely think the future plans call for a true app store for the platform, and the ability for developers to monetize their creations. I think the big thing holding this up right now is the issues the platform is experiencing, especially around access to cloud resources. As I mentioned earlier, people’s expectations rise as they invest more and more into the software parts of the platform, and its just not ready for prime time.
@Adaml and others,
I’ve made some progress on the new code and I expect to be able to distribute it this weekend. Sorry about the delay, but some beta testing revealed more ST issues that I expected.
However, like I said in the thread title, I have found a solution to work around the ST platform issues.
Regards.
EDIT: You’ll receive an email with a termporary link to a google drive folder.
So, if we “donate” the required $15, does that provide us access to all the unpublished apps and the device type? Or is it $15ea?
That part is unclear.
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Hi, most of my smartapps are still available at
As far as the most complex smartapps are concerned (ex. ScheduleTstatZones, ScheduleRoomTempControl, ecobeeSetZoneWithSchedule) which are related to smart vents control, those will require an additional contribution as they took me a lot of time to develop & test.
For more information about all the smartapps that I created, please refer to
http://thingsthataresmart.wiki/index.php?title=Category:Unpublished_SmartApps
Regards.
Thats what I figured.
Wait so the $15 gets you what, just the ecobee and the remote sensors? So what is the cost for the full suite?
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Heres the next (rhetorical) question; will the early
purchasers get refunded when ST buys this as the official app?
I’m all for supporting the dev for a functioning piece of software, but for a “workaround”? Now if the apps are priced like some phone-style “in app purchases” it may be ok. But basing it on the devs required donation strategy, theyll be priced above/around $10.
That’s my opinion.
@Turb02, it will be a fully functional ecobee thermostat device…Users who install it will have access to all the features described here:
http://thingsthataresmart.wiki/index.php?title=My_Ecobee_Device
Your rhetorical question is very theoretical at this point… In the meantime, for few bucks, you’ll enjoy the full features of your ecobee thermostat(s) at your home…
Cheers.
So for those who do contribute, how will the updates roll out as needed? Will there be an email notification when updated, with the link? Will we have to rely on checking back here for updated code?
And still, what will the cost be for the ad-hoc apps?
Hi @Turb02, I’m still working on the details.
My 1st priority right now is to deliver a stable MyEcobee device this weekend. After, I have many options:
- Setup a private github for those who contribute
or
- Setup a private store
I’m planning to offer different bundles for different needs.
For example, 1 bundle could be some of the apps for smart vents control, another one could be for optimal temp control…
There could be several bundles for technical support (1 month, 3 months, 1 year).
There could be some bundles for HA consulting/customizations of my existing smartapps.
And, there could be some for code upgrades (1 year upgrade for $x dollars).
Those are just ideas at the moment. If you have any feedback, let me know.
Regards.
What would the tech consist of? I hope updates arent “tech support”.
Your ideas are good, however, your approach is off. In my opinion, you need to outline all of these things before people commit to a product. That way, they know what theyre getting for their money. Thats SOP for a business.
Lets say I want to buy this device type (your paypal link is open in another window as I type this). Eventually I want to install smart vents to “zone” my house. Now, I expect updates as required, at the price I pay up front (this isnt an OS upgrade from windows XP to 10, more so a hotfix or bug fix). At the upfront price of $15 for the device type and all its bug fixes/refinement releases, its a good deal. If its expected to pay for updates and bug fixes, that may cause an issue with some customers (me being one).
Example: I pay for Adobe Lightroom (a one time fee). When there are updates to the software (not new features), I get the updates for free. If there is a new release (Lightroom 7.0?) and If I want the new features in that version, I pay for the new version with the features that werent in version 6.5. If I choose to not pay for the latest feature rich version, version 6.5 is still supported for n+3 versions, until that software version is EOL.
When I go to add the smart vent app, a nominal fee (identified at the release of the new pricing structure of the device type, e.g. now) is expected so I know what Im buying into. If I know pricing is just going to keep growing for this (unknown cost for the feature-rich apps, bug fixes, patches, etc.), I may look another way for my solution.
So, You may have something here, but your approach is off. Your customers want to see the structure before they commit. Theres too many unknown variables for me to click the “Donate $15.00 USD now” button.
Im looking forward to what your decisions/solutions are.
@Turb02, like I said, I’m open to ideas…I’m planning to think about it during the Christmas season.
I could set up a fee for “all you can eat bundle” for all the smartapps and another one for support.
Support is time consuming so I want to be paid for it.
As far as the app per se, at $15 for a device type like MyEcobee (>3000 lines of code) is not expensive given the list of features.
For minor upgrades & fine tuning, those could be included in the initial price tag.
Now, for major upgrades, those cannot be included in the price as ST and ecobee make changes sometimes that I cannot control and cause major headaches for me (just like the last one).
Those are ideas that I’m thinking at the moment. I do not want to scare people off, but like I said in earlier posts, I have a full time job and a family, and till it becomes more than a hobby, I need to be rewarded correctly so that the hundreds of hours (probably more than 1500 hours) I spent coding & testing the code I’ve developed are corrected invested for the future …
It is just a matter of balancing my life a little bit better…
Regards.
Then my suggestion would be to add worthwhile features when a “major upgrade” is required to continue expected functionality, especially if youll be charging for the fix.
I totally get where you are coming from, but I don’t think you are going to get to a point where this is “worth it” for you as a business venture except if you charge very high prices, in which case you will turn off the vast number of customers who cannot afford it and almost guarantee that somebody else comes in and creates an alternative product. This is coming from many years spent on the business side of software.
Basically you are outlining a model with an upfront license cost, then an ongoing maintenance / support cost, but that does not include major new upgrades. That is not standard. If you want to charge for ongoing support, then that needs to include software upgrades.
Also, remember, for mobile apps, people have been conditioned for many years to expect very low costs, with ongoing changes in functionality and support. $15 is going to seem like a lot when you can buy very complex mobile apps that consist of 1000s more lines of code for $1.99. Then when you get into charging for all the other components, and maintenance, people will feel nickel and dimed.
Fundamentally, I think you have to make a choice. If you are looking to turn this is a worthwhile business venture, I just don’t think the fundamentals are there. What is the size of the market? Can you estimate how many people have installed your app? You need to find users that use both ecobee and smartthings, and are looking for the more advanced use cases. I have no idea how many people that is but its not 1000s upon 1000s of people. Then you are not going to convert more than 10% of them to paid users. Just not going to happen. Not sure what you do for a living but with this size market, its not going to be enough to replace whatever you get paid an hour in your current employment. Thus, it will never make sense from a pure economics based on where we are now. So you have to decide if the satisfaction you get from contributing to the community is pay enough. If not, contribute your code to open source and let somebody else take over. Otherwise, you are going to have to take a more long term view of this as a business.
The previous paragraph is exactly why there is no app store yet for ST. There will be when the market is ready. And THEN you will be well positioned to make some money. If I was in your position, I would move back to a free model for your core product, and continue to build up a customer base. Then I would move to a freemium model where the majority is free but you charge for some more advanced stuff and support. Finally when the ST app store opens you can move to a fully chargeable model and your legions upon legions of customers will follow you. Just my opinion based on my life experience.
Oh, and if you are waiting for ST to buy your app, I doubt that will happen. They dont want the headaches. That is exactly why they have an open platform, so 3rd parties can meet their needs. Why buy something that you already have? Are more people going to buy the ST hub if Samsung owns your app? No. You are worth more to them as a third party dev. You dont see apple and google buying up all the top selling apps in their appstores either.
I hope you take this note in the spirit it is meant, which is to help the community around this platform.
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Ouch - With this model if I had an Ecobee, I would just look at getting a different thermostat, and temperature sensors… $15.00 Every time ST or Ecobee break this device type is what it sounds like. I bought a CT100 from Ebay(I think it was like $20 bucks) that works great, but was thinking of switching to have more robust features. But I could buy a zwave/zigbee temperature sensor for each time that they break the device type and use the initial upfront savings to do the same what would I really Gain by switching?
@Turb02 Nailed it on the head and it seems that you may have misinterpreted. If you Add functionality, it is totally acceptable to offer a New product/version.But people have already purchased version “1” and it should be updated to work as good as it did on day one regardless of what ST/Ecobee do to break it for “x” amount of time, maybe that means the price needs to go up IDK, but for sure you need to have clear terms, conditions and expectations with your customer base.
I hope its not the case, but it sure sounds like you’re trying to sell a product with no guarantees, or warranty. If it breaks tomorrow customers are sol. I would most certainly not consider becoming a customer with terms like these.
I think that for me, the most important thing in the EcoBee3 ST implimentation is gaining access to the remote sensor data for Smart Things to use in other ways. I have paid $15 for that just a few hours ago, and as soon as the code is completed this weekend then I will be happy I did.
The smart things open/close sensors and the motion, for example, give temp data as well. If I can integrate those into my Ecobee control too, then that’s wonderful also.
I agree though, if I pay $15 (which I have), then I’d like to have a working product for a minimum of a few years, no questions asked.
Currently, I just want to change the fan runtime settings based on comfort profile.
I do have some Keen smart vents pre-ordered that I want to use as well in the future.
I would also like to be able to trigger the fan when temperature variance gets too great… so for me, I am not sure that I would be willing to pay too much as an ongoing cost for those features, but I am willing to pay something. People deserve reward for services rendered.
It is certainly complicated to try and workout such things. For me, it is IT work. I am a full-time IT person and have some side-work clients that I took care of back when my pay grade was not so great. However, now that I make more and have gotten older, I have reduced down to just a few whom I feel loyalty to as my time has become much more valuable to me.
So the question is, how much do you have to make in order for it to be worth the time?
Hello to all recent contributors,
I just sent an email to all recent contributors with more details about the upcoming release.
Please check your paypal verified email address… I will use this address to release the new code
to any contributor.
Regards.