Yeah I get where that emotive language can come off as a bit much. But if SmartThings isn’t willing to take some of that responsibility it probably shouldn’t market itself that way…
Maybe I can just relate more with 18 month old twins. I find it very difficult to do many required tasks while physically remaining within reach of both children 100% of the time. As such I got risk mitigation technologies like a baby gate to keep my kids in the kitchen and safe from the risk of falling down the stairs. That gate has taken on some of the responsibility I used to own where I knew I couldn’t be more than a few feet away and must have focused attention on them at any given time.
Sure if they overcome this properly installed gate at the exact moment I’m 8 feet away not watching as I load the dishwasher, that’s still my fault. I’m responsible for their well being and the gate mitigation decision. However I’m darn sure not going to be happy with the gate manufacturer who marketed itself as a means of keeping my kids from getting close to the stairs, a promise I then leveraged in order to be far enough away from them to make their dinner or clean their sippy cups… If I can’t rely on some form of leverage for my mitigation, whats the point of the purchase?
Of course the difference in the two examples is one technology has some kinds of certification (albeit voluntary in US) like ASTM and JPMA, designed to ensure these technologies are likely to perform. Whereas SmartThings has no independent organization certifying their product for these use cases that they market themselves as solving. So I agree with those that say research is necessary.
However I don’t have any issue with taking them task when the leverage they claim to offer isn’t realized.
2 Likes
tgauchat
(ActionTiles.com co-founder Terry @ActionTiles; GitHub: @cosmicpuppy)
22
Is the “issue” is that consumers fail to read the Terms of Use and referenced Guidelines?
Data accuracy and consistency from SmartThings sensors, including those provided by SmartThings directly, resold by SmartThings, or supported by SmartThings, is not guaranteed. Therefore, you should not rely on that data for any use that impacts health, safety, security, property or financial interests.
Or is the “issue” that SmartThings puts out marketing materials (and add-on services like Scout integrated monitoring…) that clearly contradict those Terms of Use?
PS: The only correct answer, IMHO, is “both”; Corporate responsibility cannot be dismissed (such as the successful lawsuit by a McDonald’s patron who was burned by excessively hot coffee) … but now, is it sufficient that coffee cups are labeled “warning, the liquid inside is hot and may cause burns”… !?!
Not that I have this issue because I employ locks at the top of my doors that my kids can’t reach. But…there are kids that wake in the middle of the night and can very well unlock doors and walk out. Not saying I’d depend on ST to save me there, which is why I have locks my kids can’t reach in the first place.
So looking from both angles…
Don’t trust any one thing to keep your kids in check.
And…who can keep their eyes on their kids 24/7 say…when you’re asleep?
…just as a cell phone isn’t supposed to be a spontaneous weapon of mass distraction, AND Terry @tgauchat , I swear I did my fair share of research before I traded in my phone
It isn’t the emotion I take issue with. It’s the implication that the child’s safety is primarily ST’s responsibility, and that it was just luck that he and his wife keep an eye on their child, thus saving ST from causing a disaster.
ST should certainly take responsibility for any failures of their product’s advertised functionality. But I don’t think they market that product as the first line of defense for your child’s safety. Perhaps an analogy would help:
I hunt and target shoot using firearms recreationally. Since I’m an adult and not a complete idiot (sure, there are some who would argue with that) I understand that knowing and implementing firearms safety practices is my responsibility when engaging in these pursuits. These practices include - but are not limited to - the well-known “four rules”, as well as using firearms equipped with one or more safety mechanisms. But given that I didn’t design or manufacture any of my guns the reliability of the latter is at least somewhat out of my control. As such they are very much NOT my first line of defense from injury/death due to a mishap. A religious adherence to the aforementioned four rules (Treat all guns as loaded, Never point the gun at anything you don’t intend to shoot, Keep your finger off the trigger until you’re ready to shoot, Be sure of your target and what’s behind it) fills that role, and is 100% my responsibility. The safety mechanism(s) built into the guns are there to save my (and/or someone else’s) arse in the event that I screw up on my primary responsibility. If I were to aim a rifle at a hunting buddy with my finger on the trigger with the manual safety engaged, and the safety mechanism fails…it’s not going to be legitimate for me to claim that failure “led to” my buddy taking a .30-06 round to the gut. My stupid irresponsibility would be what led to that. The mechanical safety just failed to save us from said irresponsibility.
Now before anyone gets their jimmies rustled here, I’m not implying any irresponsibility on the part of the OP (or anyone else). I’m simply making a point about blame assessment in hypothetical events. Maybe it was just a poor choice of words on OP’s part and he really meant something other than “If my son had been hurt it would have been YOUR fault”, but it certainly came across that way.
4 Likes
tgauchat
(ActionTiles.com co-founder Terry @ActionTiles; GitHub: @cosmicpuppy)
28
I know that was a typo … but from someone who is on this Community far too much, and far too obsessed with home automation; I think it is pretty darn accurate to say that: SmartThingsis a weapon of distraction!
If we were talking about lawsuits then sure Terms of Use. But we’re talking about getting criticized for getting on a forum for complaining, so in that context, I’m not really that concerned with the product’s legalese. The OP didn’t threaten to sue. He just complained that you shouldn’t advertise iced coffee if what you serve is 100 degrees .
I don’t know who “we” is, but I’m certainly not criticizing anyone simply for complaining about the product’s failures…nor have I seen anyone else do so.
Personally I believe there is a difference in trusting a device to alert you to danger vs trusting a device to not be dangerous. I have a Note 7…it hasn’t smoked yet. But it’s nice that Samsung will be replacing it next week and that they forgo the usual Apple technique of blaming it on the customer first (“you’re holding it wrong”, “you aren’t supposed to put it in your pocket, blue jeans need to be redesigned…” etc)
Ha nice…I don’t bother with fire extinguisher. I’ve never won the lottery before…if I ever do, I doubt it will be a battery…if I decide to irrationally believe I will win, it will be money.
I love how the original post has been hijacked into two unrelated topics (one about tech/kids and another about marketing.)
To the OP: I understand your pain. For some of us that have been around (more or less) for years, it’s worse. We’ve invested a very significant amount of time in “free” customer/technical support (us helping other users) and free developer skills (developing devices/apps) only to have ST do basically the same things.
The question you have to ask yourself now is: Will you continue to try and trust them, or just move on?
So, basically, it’s Samsung’s right to lie to you on the front page, as long as they burry a small-print disclaimer somewhere.
Let’s see,
The SmartThings app offers a complete home monitoring and security solution that allows customers to get instant alerts if there’s unwanted entry, smoke, leaks, or other unexpected activity.
but…
you should not rely on that data for any use that impacts health, safety, security, property or financial interests.
In other words, SmartThings is not fit for any real-life purpose. It can only be used for amusement and entertainment. Or, to put it bluntly, it’s a toy! Oh, irony…
.
I have a Note 7…it hasn’t smoked yet. But it’s nice that Samsung will be replacing it next week and that they forgo the usual Apple technique of blaming it on the customer first (“you’re holding it wrong”, “you aren’t supposed to put it in your pocket, blue jeans need to be redesigned…” etc)