Searching for a light switch that does not need neutral (for EU)

this is my first post here. I prefer searching for the answers myself and read a lot the forum. But unfortunately, I cannot find a solution to my problem.
I’m looking for a wall light switch (it will be better if it’s a dimmer) working with Smartthings. So I’m living in a flat. I want all my switches to be smart.
The problems:

  1. I don’t have neutral in the wall switch box. The wires are in the wall itself and if I want to add neutral I will need to break the wall and the ceiling which at the moment it’s not an option.
  2. The boxes in the whole flat are small. I tried to put fibaro but the whole is too small to fit it. The walls are concrete. In the worst case scenario, I will make them bigger but this is the last resort.
  3. The wholes are circles (check the image), not squares.
    There is an option with smart bulbs but I don’t like it, it will be too expensive and if someone turns off the switch I will be not able to turn them on with a voice. Of course, there is an option to disable the wall switches and add smart buttons, but I don’t like it. Sonoff touch will be perfect but it needs a neutral wire. Aqara switches are also fine but they don’t fit in my wall, they are squares. From what I have read most of the z-wave switches needs a neutral wire. Most of the switches I have found need neutral or won’t fit in my wall.
    If someone has a suggestion for such a switch will be great.

Most people in your situation do use the in wall Micros, either at the switchbox or at the ceiling rose.

The Aeotec nano is a bit smaller than the Fibaro that you tried, so that might be worth checking out. The dimmer model does not require a neutral.

Dimensions: 42.5 x 40 x 20 mm

The Fibaro dimmer 2 dimensions:

Dimensions (LxWxH): 43 x 38 x 22mm

1 Like

Thanks. I will check the ceiling option. But if the wall switch is off the dimmer in the ceiling rose will not work, right.
After putting Fibaro in the wall switch box, it was full. Nothing else could not be added.

if you put the micro at the ceiling rose, it can still work. It just depends on the exact wiring. @anon36505037 May be able to say more.

1 Like

I used Aeotec Micro Smart Switches in the ceiling rose and the lights can be operated from the wall switch or from Smartthings.


What happens if you turned off the physical wall switch off? Can you turn on the lights with the micro smart switch? I think the connection is not closed and it will not work but I may be wrong.

We have standard toggle wall switches and the micro switch in the ceiling rose will turn the lights on and off irrespective of the wall switch position.

So to answer your question you can still operate the lights even with the wall switch off.

1 Like

For those wanting to know how an on/off switch can be used with a micro switch or dimmer module.

What you do is use a ‘momentary’ type switch rather than a traditional on/off switch, when this is pressed it sends a signal to the micro switch or dimmer, it is no longer itself responsible for cutting power at the switch.

For 2-wire circuits as sadly still common in the UK, you use a dimmer module, the dimmer module then (immediately) dims the light to effectively zero but lets enough residual power through to still power the dimmer module itself. If you have a 3-wire circuit then you can genuinely cut all the power to the light.

Here is an example of a momentary switch -

This can be a 2-way or 3-way, with 2-way you have on and off signals, with a 3-way you can have dim up, dim down and mid position. That is with a 2-way you can press to turn on (or off) i.e. invert the status, with a 3-way a brief press down (or up) turns on (or off) and a long press dims or brightens.

It is also possible to do a 2-way i.e. on and off momentary pull-cord switch. In the UK light switches in bathrooms are supposed to be in the form of pull-cords so as to avoid any water being near the switch itself.

If you are intending to fit smart light ‘switches’ a bit of a misnomer since the smarts are in the module not the switch then I echo the comment of @anon36505037 and say you should get momentary switches. These are available in a variety of styles but I am planning to use ones that are plain white plastic and hence very similar to ordinary switches. See the Polar mini grid range as below.