Get ready to make the switch!

I’m guessing you were using custom alerts in SHM, for which there are no replacement for in the new app. I had to do the same thing. And guess what, even though your routines migrates, the automations have too many issues to count making them useless.

@blake.arnold when are all the issues with automations going to get resolved? It’s one thing to ask people to migrate away from routines, but it is totally unfair to have us migrate when the replacement has multiple high impact bugs.


My “go on vacation” routine failed because I had it arming SHM (that’s the only time I use it). I removed that action, reran the migration, and all clear. It took an extra step to recreate that because Go On Vacation turned into a scene - automations need to run automatically and this routine was only triggered manually - and scenes don’t allow STHM control. I had to create a separate automation to arm STHM when the mode goes to vacation. No big deal, just another thing to get used to with the new regime.


So is this a new thing that preconditions aren’t working in automations? STHM stuck in an endless loop arming/disarming. I swear it worked yesterday. Had to disable my automations. Seriously regret migrating. It ruined a setup that had worked for many years. I’m losing faith in SmartThings by the second. What a horrible experience this migration has been. Been along with them for a long time, even upgraded and on my second hub. I purchased so many of their ST device to assure maximum compatibility, but sure this will be my last and this hub might soon be thrown out of a moving car. So disappointing.


You and I both. None of my routines that depend on preconditions actually respect them. For example this simple automation runs in every mode.

Add to that they don’t interpret presence properly either. For example, another simple, but critical automation I have runs when someone leaves, instead of when someone arrives.

I’ve been rock solid for years as well. And while I expected some bumps rewriting my routines to work with the new automation schema (which I like better in theory), I foolishly expected them to actually work.

… thankfully I wasn’t stupid enough to move to the new Alexa skill.


I so agree - it is so hard to figure out what unexpectedly turned something on or off when the history doesn’t tell you. A lot of people have asked for this - hoping it’s somewhere on the roadmap.


Yes, I did have a few Custom alerts in SHM. Maybe that was the issue.

Agreed. I do miss the Routines where you could do everything… arm/disarm SHM, set modes, perform some action - all based upon certain conditions. I also wish you could manually trigger Automations, which would be like manually clicking my old Routines (b/c the Automations call a scene). In order to get around this, I think I’m going to create some “Virtual Buttons” (which will just be Virtual Switches), that will trigger the Automation and the ensuing Scene. It will help my wife transition from clicking the old “Routine buttons” to do various things. :slight_smile:

On a related note, if people haven’t seen it yet, you can check out this excellent post by @JDRoberts for info on using Scenes & Automations:
FAQ: How to Run Scenes and Automations (New V3 App) (2020)


“Routines“ served so many purposes in the Classic App. Why an equivalent feature is not available in the New App is beyond me.

Seriously, I have to create a Virtual device, which takes a way from your 300 device limit, just to execute something manually or programmatically. Not cool. Not cool at all.


@JDRoberts, I think the old 300 device limit was an artifact/limit of the classic app. Have you seen anything about the device limits of newapp?

Haven’t seen anything one way or the other except the 20 room limit in the new V3 app.

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Have you seen any changes to your preconditions? I’m on my second night where my automations don’t work. I’ve lost ability to manage STHM through my normal automations because it’s ignoring the preconditions.

I’ve never looked so hard at replacing SmartThings as I am currently. So sad that a once solid, reliable system has been ruined so badly by Samsung. My system is unusable, and even removing my automations and trying to recreate them after migrating hasn’t even worked out for me. I’m saddened by the amount of money I’ve committed to ST branded devices only to have them ruin it so badly with this update. I will be moving off of the ST platform.

Support has been useless. “Have you tried deleting the app and reinstalling” does not fix the issues they have created with this poor migration.

They seem to be working, but you have to go into the automation, edit something and save it again. I say seem, because I’ve only lightly tested.

The arrival presence rules are a whole other mess…

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@swamplynx Looks like I just stumbled across what you mentioned. I went in, edited and re-saved and that allowed my automations to work again. Thanks for that tip.

Automations seem to work again, but looks like now my issue is that all of my scenes literally do nothing. So I’m back to being able to arm/disarm my STHM with virtual switches with my automations but since none of the scenes work, none of the actions I’m trying to get to work based on those scenes are initiating. Some of my scenes are triggered based on presence, or time, or as a trigger by pushing the scene’s button won’t trigger anything.

Seems to be the new normal with ST, one issue clears up just to create another. I’ve never had to work so hard to keep this hub working in the many years I’ve been on this platform.

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Honestly, I just deleted the automations and scenes that the migration tool did and started over. The issue is that the entire schema has changed. Not necessarily bad (if things worked properly), it’s just different than the routines schema, and you can’t adopt the new schema properly with the migration tool. Your approach to automation has to change to properly adopt the new schema. Biggest misses that I still see:

  1. No ability to control STHM through scenes, so you need virtual switches to do something simple like unlock your front door and disarm the alarm.

  2. Presence works fine (aside from there isn’t a way to view it in the app), but presence automations are totally hosed. If you have an automation that is supposed to run when someone arrives (while other people in the same condition are home), it oddly runs when you leave. Presumably because the logic is effed, and it runs as someone (anyone else in the same automation) else is home. The must be away for X minutes condition isn’t respected or is nonsensical. I think I worked around this by making multiple “unlock and disarm in home mode” automations for each individual person.

  3. The lack of showing what SA or automation acted on a device in the device history for troubleshooting.

  4. And of course last but not least the Alexa / Google f up, where you can’t select the devices you want exposed.


Surely the doors opening should be the trigger, and the mode should be the precondition? Otherwise it will only check whether the doors are open at the moment the mode changes, not for the rest of the time.


Thanks @swamplynx. Everything you summarize just confirms the reason it’s time to give up on SmartThings. If I’m going to delete everything and start over, I’ll just find a way to do what I need in another platform. Such a shame. As you know, SmartThings used to be great. This is no longer the same product, or company. And for me, time to move on. Thanks again for confirming what I was seeing and for sharing the things you’ve learned through this migration.


Sorry if this was mentioned earlier in this thread… but did anyone notice that scenes don’t run if any of the devices in them are unavailable (e.g. I have one broken GE switch that I have not replaced yet.)?
And because it’s the new app, it does not even tell me which device it is. I found it out by removing it and running the scene manually. Also, it says that the scene ran but in fact it did not

It’s just missing the 404 infront of “unknown”…

Does smartthings/Samsung have a test group or do they just let the devs test their own code??


Yeah, us and the rest of their other customers…


Samsung software is full of bugs because most of their apps don’t have public beta channels. They release it and hope it works.
If you find a bug, submit a bug report to Samsung and they will usually fix it.

I’ve not been able to figure out a couple of things with the new ways. I’m yet to use migration tool as I’m a bit worried about a few things.

Do virtual momentary switches migrate? I can’t see my existing ones when setting up Automations in the new app. They appear in the devices list and rooms but are “unresponsive”. In the Classic app these still all work great.

Losing Echo Speaks is a huge loss and there’s no way I’ve found that can replace some of the notifications I use (e.g. construct a dynamic string in WebCore and then send that too all devices to say). Any ideas?

I think I can workaround some stuff by triggering Alexa routines. How can I do this from Smartthings in the new app. I can’t see Alexa stuff in there so do I need a virtual switch (preferably momentary) that Alexa watches for?

Can WebCore see the new Scenes to activate them? I had trouble with this in the past so use classic routines with WebCore.

Cheers for the help.