Extreme lag with ST web services

Okay, thanks. I don’t see any devices that say DTH.

I think this will be my stopping point for tonight. Tomorrow, I’ll go through my devices and do an inventory of which devices are using which drivers and then go through and see which drivers I can remove.

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switch the Edge drivers for your devices you noted above to @phil30 Edge drivers, run z-wave repair and reboot your hub.

if still experiencing a lag, identify if there any unused Edge drivers on your hub that you can remove.

There are also other community members who can offer further assistance.

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Okay, I know I said I was done for the night, but I did one more thing, I clicked through all the devices and:

  1. Devices listed as GE, I switched the switched the driver
  2. I found there were actually a few devices where type was “DTH,” so tomorrow I will force remove those and re-add them (many of them are offline, which was a problem I was going to tackle after the lag, but I’m guessing that’s the problem now)

yep… exclude them and pair them again… Add Device > by brand > z-wave

offline devices will cause havoc

In the API Browser+, go to Locations->Hubs-> Installed Drivers. This will show you all the drivers installed to your hub. Then highlight a driver and click on List Devices. This will show you all devices, if any, that are utilizing that driver.

Devices-> Drivers is a list of any drivers you have created.

In addition to Z-Wave and Zigbee Edge drivers, there are LAN Edge drivers for devices like Sonos and that have been used to create virtual devices that run on your hub instead of the cloud. There are also Matter Edge drivers that support both Wi-Fi and Thread devices. Cloud to Cloud device integrations are identified as Viper devices. Samsung appliances and TVs are OCF devices.

The filter feature in the Devices list is a quick way to see how many devices of the various types you have in your ST setup.


Okay, so a huge thank you for your help so far. I’ve cleared up unused devices, deleted some old virtual switches that I forgot were, in fact virtual, restarted my hub, ran the Zwave repair (with a few error messages, screenshot below), cleared up old routines and now every device listed in ST is online.

However, I’m still getting the same lag. After more clicking, I found the filter in the API to see my 19 DTH devices. A few of them are switches that I’m not sure if they’re GE or not, so later I’ll remove the switch plate to check the brand. But many or random sensors and scene controllers. I tried to “Change Driver,” but I get a message that it’s an “Ineligible Device.”

Is my best approach here to one-by-one remove those devices and re-add them?

Are all devices experiencing the lag including both Edge driver devices and DTH devices?

Either from the API Browser+ or the legacy IDE, you should be able to see the fingerprint of the devices using DTHs and we can probably figure out what they are without you having to physically inspect them. Even if you don’t know what manufacturer they are, if you remove and re-add them to your network, they should pick up a stock ST Edge driver, barring any custom DTHs installed in the legacy IDE.

You can only use the Change Driver function in the API Browser+ once a device is on an Edge driver. To convert from a DTH to Edge, you have exclude the device from your network, delete any custom DTHs from the IDE if present for that device, and then re-install the device. The only other way is to wait for ST to migrate them at some point in time.

Unknown device during the Z-Wave repair seems troublesome to me. The app doesn’t give you a lot of info, but I think the hub log in the legacy IDE may show you more info such as Z-Wave network ID that could help you track down what devices are the issue.

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Just an update to let everyone know where I’m at…the short version is - apparently the state of my Smart Home is a mess!

I started with 18 DTH devices, I’ve been going through and removing/re-adding them one by one. In doing so, I also discovered that two of the switches aren’t working and the Lighting Automation SmartApp I was using was deprecated alongside Groovy.

I’ve still got another 7 devices to go through and then an Amazon order to replace old stuff. Everything is running slow still, but many of the devices I’ve re-added are giving a message that “all the statuses haven’t updated, check back later,” so I’m assuming it’s like updating all your apps on a factory reset phone and my poor hub is struggling to keep up with all the updates.

Thanks to everyone who has helped guide my way. I guess now it’s time to research Matter switches so I can start the transition with the stuff that needs to be replaced.

which smartapp was it?

once you get rid of all offline z-wave devices and those Unknown from z-wave repair, I expect you would see an improvement. may be a tough road getting there.

keep us informed.

ask the community for advice before purchasing. Several community members have purchased Matter devices and can provide you with helpful info.

It was the “Lighting Automation” Smart App. I moved it all to routines.

I got everything moved, ran Zwave Repair and restarted my hub, but the lag isn’t better. I still had fewer, but a few Unknowns on the Zwave repair, and now I have devices randomly going offline - it’s not a constant online/offline thing, but it just seems every hour or two some of the devices come online and a different two or three go offline.

So if there’s any guidance on the next step of troubleshooting, I’d appreciate it.

Any pattern to tHe devices falling offline? All z-wave? Are all using Edge drivers or are some using DTH? Devices migrated by ST or any you excluded and added back? All of the same brand?

There have been many users reporting similar issues with devices falling offline/online consistently. (may or may not be related)

I’m officially off DTH drivers, so they are all on Edge. It looked like a lot of the ones I removed a re-added, but they all seem to be up and running now, except for a lone door sensor that’s the old SmartThings PGC313 Multi Sensor. The batteries were dead at the start of this escapade, but I did replace the batteries, removed the device and re-added it. It was connected for a while, but now it’s offline.

if it was added with the stock Edge driver (zigbee contact)… you can try using @Mariano_Colmenarejo Edge driver and see if there is an improvement (or not).

I will let you look through his listings and check the fingerprint to see if it is supported: https://community.smartthings.com/t/edge-driver-mc-zigbee-drivers-for-motion-open-close-moisture-smoke-co-sensors-and-others-devices/231689

It may be his Zigbee Contact Mc: Edge driver

but then again… anything I have posted has not improved your lag :slight_smile:

That is the mobile app attempting to tell you that the devices have null values for one or more attributes. It has never been clear why it can’t just work with the ones it does have instead of getting its knickers in a twist.

Conventionally integrations create synthetic events to initialise the attributes but I noticed that these were temporarily disabled in stock Edge drivers last year. I presumed they confused the issue when migrating devices with the trade off being confusing the issue when installing devices instead. Why the app can’t just say which attributes it is waiting for is another mystery, as then you might be able to help it out by ‘playing’ with the devices.


I made a discovery - the issue seems to be with Z-wave controlled devices, and it’s not always, but it is MOST of the time. A few things I tested:

  • turning on/off Zigbee lights through app/Alexa happens instantly
  • turning on/off Z-wave lights through app/Alexa lags
  • Routine that turns on closet light (Z-Wave) when the door opens (Zigbee sensor) lags
  • Routine that turns on LED lights trips (Zigbee) when a switch (Zwave) is flipped happens instantly

The Zwave repair is down to one Unknown device, but all Zwave devices are showing online in the app.

Is it possible there’s something with the Zwave controller in the hub? Is there a way to test that? Is there anything else I can do to troubleshoot?

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Try contacting ST support to see if they are able to assist. They may be able to determine what the UNKNOWN item is.


A couple of other things to check using API Browser+:

  • Check the fingerprints of all your Z-Wave devices to be sure they registered properly and that you don’t have any with all zeroes
  • If you have Z-Wave Plus devices, did S2 security properly authenticate or does it show failed? Edge architecture is more finicky about S2 security
  • Check that the Provisioning State is Provisioned

After all that, it might be time to start doing some driver logging to get a sense of how commands are being processed and received. That is done with the ST CLI tool from a Linux/Windows/Mac computer. We can go further into that later if necessary.


Can you tell me a little more about where to find this? I clicked through the Devices and I couldn’t find “Fingerprints” anywhere.

I’m pretty sure the security failed on all of them.

Thanks for your help!

Did you add Plus devices via QR code or Search Nearby? If you did Search Nearby and didn’t provide the DSK, it would fail. Not saying this is the problem, but trying to eliminate as many variables as possible.

All that device info is in the Details for a device. Forgot fingerprints isn’t the term anymore. It’s Mfg Code.

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So I wanted to wrap this up - I don’t know exactly what solved the issue, but the lag is pretty much gone (occasionally something will take a while when commanded through the echo, but for the most part, I’m good now).

I replaced two switches that were bad and removed and re-added a few devices that didn’t seem to migrate to Edge drivers. I then went through and searched for device-specific Edge drivers as applicable and things are running smoothly now.

For anyone who might need it - check out Asurion Home+ as it’s a service contract that replaces all your home electronics, including smart devices. I’ve had several devices fail over the past few years and Asurion sends me $50 for each failed device so I can go ahead and replace it.