On the verge of giving up hope

Would you be willing to try testing your response times for devices from my.smartthings.com?

Trying to nail down if it’s an issue with your hub, your zwave mesh, your ZigBee mesh, your hub wifi connection (you said you have the aeotec hub) or your client app. Let’s divide and conquer!

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Already done… the web interface is VERY fast, practically instantaneous. If it had widgets I could use on my phone, did not require frequent log in, and had full app functionality (e.g., automation development), I would be using it as my primary interface.

This convinces me it’s the phone app.

I can share videos where it takes me about 35 seconds to turn on a lamp using my phone after opening the app. Once I log in to the my.smartthings.com interface, I can have the lamp on immediately.

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if the mesh is good and the delay is still bad then the cloud is the main component of lag.

Sometimes lag that can be worked around by bigger zoning to make neighboring motion sensors trigger more-distant-lights. When you enter the garage then it triggers the kitchen lights. Less-than-optimal but it can work, I use this on a few zones.

Anything REALLY important, just put it on a direct-wired motion switch and be done, no delay at all, no smarts needed.

That’s both good and bad! The good is that your home infrastructure is working and stable. The bad is that it’s not usable with your choice of client. I can see where that would be frustrating! The Android version of the client went thru several iterations of unstable as well. It’s better now but still has some rough edges (no pun intended.)

How about using SharpTools as your client on iOS instead?

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Not SharpTools, but I have given a shot to “The Home Remote” instead.

Trouble is that Smartthings Home Monitor (STHM) is a cornerstone of my setup. The Home Remote does not control it directly, so I needed to configure workarounds with virtual switches to change the modes, and there is no way to dismiss an alert (if the alarm is automatically activated - which unfortunately happens often enough) without going in to the Smartthings client. Some of the workarounds have required automations in Webcore which is eventually going away as well.

I got so far as to trying to re-create the functionality of STHM with the Smartthings automations/Routines, but it did not work well. I could do it with Webcore, but the Routines are limited and operate funny when multiple conditions are involved, and I was getting a lot of false triggers and had to generate way too many Routines with independent conditions. Again, I was trying to avoid Webcore, so I tried to keep exclusively with the Routines approach, and it got impossible to manage and have it work properly.

Finally, there are a number of other nuances that made it difficult to switch clients - no widgets available (I need to have a quick way for my wife to be able to do things as she has no interest in opening apps and playing around with home automation), notifications still have to come through the Smartthings app requiring me to keep both active, some devices didn’t port over to The Home Remote properly and could not be controlled, etc.

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A high (near infinite as possible) WAF is paramount to any HA success. :slight_smile: Totally understood!

It sounds like SHM integration is still not available from 3rd party apps like SharpTools as well. Their forums discuss options with virtual switches and such that you’ve done similar with The Home Remote.

Would a web view kiosk type wrapper “app” around my.smartthings.com do enough to get you the direct control of SHM you’re looking for? It would still be two apps (Smartthings for notifications, web wrapper app for control) but it might be good enough?

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Not really. The Smartthings app has other deficiencies that remain unresolved. Widgets are unreliable - they now open the app and unless you leave the app on the right screen during previous use, the associated scenes don’t always run. The app requires frequent log in and acceptance of terms of service (every couple of days) due to other acknowledged bugs. The geofencing/location functions that I use for other automations also broke within the last few months in the app. I would need 2 or 3 additional workarounds to use all of the functionality that’s already (supposed to be) part of the one app.

Truthfully (and this is absolutely not directed at you - I genuinely appreciate the help!!! - but it’s the culmination of a lot of frustration experienced over many months), the Smartthings app has all of the functionality that I need, and has had it almost forever, it just doesn’t work properly. I shouldn’t need to use work-arounds and multiple apps to accomplish what one app is already (poorly) equipped to do. The experiences we are having on iOS are basic operability issues that should not have made it in to one release of an app, let alone three or four subsequent releases. They get worse and more breaks with every new release. And I know I’m not alone - there are very few who say the iOS app “works well”, on this forum and others in which I participate. Most are experiencing the same. Of all the mobile apps I’ve ever used, this is the one that has been the most fundamentally messed up and unable to be fixed over so many months. I’ve not experienced anything like it with any other service I use. Support is inept and despite initiating many cases, and sending logs and videos, cannot comprehend the issues that are being experienced.

Samsung and Smartthings should be embarrassed on so many levels, their app team and the iOS app products are the definition of ‘fail’.

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I understand where you’re coming from. OTOH, the app and its connectivity are provided for the low low price of free, so I guess you get what you pay for. I personally feel there’s a lot of value but I’m using Android and aren’t as frustrated as iOS users. Doesn’t take away from how you’re feeling, I get it!

The app is free, but we did pay for a hub that was ostensibly controlled by something other than the one reset button on the back of it. I’m having so many, varied problems with my hub recently…and living in the post-groovy and pre-matter limbo makes it hard to determine what to do to make things suck less.

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Have to say that things have been pretty stable on my end. The only issue I’m really having now on a consistent basis is my Home Monitoring sync between my physical alarm system DCS with Alarm Server looses sync for no apparent reason. The App, although is still slower than expected, works ok for the most part. The automation rule engine is much better and server issues have not been much of an issue.

For what it’s worth, my Hubitat Hub acts act more than ST. I have close to 300 devices…

I’m not arguing with you, I guess it just depends on how much you think Samsung “owes” you and for how long? Lets say for a $100 retail hub they made $20. Do they owe us front end software on all platforms “forever”? What if Google or Apple change their entire ecosystem on mobile, how long does Samsung owe supporting them? Its always disappointing when something you value and use stops functioning (I’m still sad about ReplayTV being shutdown - best DVRs I’ve ever used!) but they can’t support it forever either. Keep in mind I’m not an iOS person, I may feel differently otherwise. :slight_smile: I also keep in mind that its a hobbyist level platform. I knew going in that there’s no guarantees offered or implied, as I’m paying $0 in support costs. If I want a dealer supported HA system I’d have to pay for that privilege.

I do hope iOS people can get fixed soon. I wish I knew an easy answer!

You’re absolutely right. And that’s what JDRoberts has talked about for years now…having a budget for device lifecycle turnover. As with many things, he’s right.

Of course, I’d gladly pay today for a hub+app that works today.

For now, I’m trying to eliminate variables by deleting smartapps and custom DTHs, removing integrations (hue, lutron, Alexa) and anything that’s not linked to the hub via Zigbee or Zwave. Slow going. But not sure what else to do.

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A reply to the general tone and content of the original post.

I understand your frustration. And I share some of the ire over certain changes that have come down the pike over the past few years.

HOWEVER.

My smart home, aside from automations broken by various vendors opting out of various integration paradigms, has been mostly working. Even though I’ve neglected it due to work overload for the past couple years. AND, as I’ve spent the past couple weeks getting back into it. I’m finding that new automations are also working! Note that I’ve worked largely in Webcore, mostly ignoring the mobile app. I have lots of devices, lots of virtual devices, lots of routines, lots of pistons, lots of integrations.

So when folks complain of certain issues, I find myself wondering whether SmartThings is really the problem. As I’m in systems professionally, I see all too many instances of people complaining that the system is the problem when perhaps the issue is elsewhere. If a person is having an issue, yet troubleshooters doing identical procedures cannot replicate that issue, it is almost guaranteed that the issue is not the system but something in the local environment.

So if you have issues, while people using virtually identical systems do not have those issues, you really need to look at your local environment.

EDIT: having read more of the replies, an addendum to the above: I don’t really use ST as an interface for manual control. I have a differentiation in my mind between automations and mere controls. I use ST for the automations mostly, while relying on other mechanisms (such as Alexa) for extemporaneous control.