What the heck are these wires in my switch box?

It’s a little hard to tell from the picture but I don’t think that single black wire is your line hot. If that’s the case and the white bundle is neutral then your light will permanently on with no control.
My guess is your white bundle is neutral and the bundle with 3 black and one white is your line hot.
Put that meter on that single black and flip a switch to confirm.

Possible the extra wires for the two bundles could be tap in from other circuits.

yeah i’d agree with @Navat604. Your 3 black+1 white bundle is most likely your hot feed, white (with black tape) to the switch and 2 hots going to to another run. Then your bundle with 4 whites is neutral feed, neutral to fixture and 2 neutrals to other runs (the same 2 as in the hot bundle). Then you have your single black coming from the switch directly to the fixture. Taking out the 2 sets of wires going to other runs, this matches the power-into-light 3-way diagram I posted earlier. You can install a smart in-wall switch, it would just have to be the type that doesn’t require a neutral since you don’t have any neutrals at your switch boxes.

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The single black wire leading to the light does change from 120V to ~30V depending on whether the switch is flipped.

That black bundle is hot 120V regardless of switch position.

So it looks like you guys are right as far as what’s what.

Still trying to figure out if I can connect an aeon micro switch in this box. In-wall switch without neutral isn’t a great option because I’ve switched to LED bulbs.

I think an Aeon micro will fit that box. I installed a few similar to that and they are tight but enough room. Either that or wait till the new emerwave relay modules. They are suppose to be half the size. Just not sure when it’s coming.

my god i am really glad i live in the UK with our only two standards of wiring colours…

if that was the UK or indeed Europe the colours would normally be for IEE standard red wires Common Live & Load, white wires traveler wire between the switches. black = neutral, oh and Green & yellow = Earth…

or the other IEC standard is Brown = Common live & Load, Blue = Neutral, Red=traveler & green/yellow = earth…

if you wire up outside of these standard you risk prosecution. but over there it seems a free for all, and you take your chances. :smile:

i should add for safety these wiring colours above are for only single phase. three phase wiring also has additional colours… oh and if the IEE & IEC standards are both used in a single installation, this legally should be clearly marked and stated on the main fuse box. “I also take no responsibility of someone in the UK or Europe tries to use this advice on this forum as qualified advice! There is also a pre-1977 IEE standard that i haven’t mentioned.”

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I still want to give it a go. But since I don’t have just one line hot wire, one black and one white wire w/ black tape heading towards switch #1, I’m not sure how to hook up the micro switch.

Do I add a pigtail from the hot bundle to the line terminal of the micro switch? That seems to make sense.

Seems less straightforward which wires in the box to connect to the switch terminals…

Here is an excellent drawing by @Thomas_Scibilia with the exact wiring configuration. To make life easier.

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Thanks. I saw that diagram in the linked topic above.

I guess one of the wires that goes into the device’s switch terminals is the black wire that’s currently going into my fixture.

I’m not as sure which wire in my fixture box corresponds to the white wire that goes into the switch terminal in the diagram.

We’ve determined the bundle of a few black plus one white includes line hot. That white wire could be running to one of the switches (which has a white wire that’s always hot attached to the common screw terminal), right? In that case, this white wire should connect to the aeon device’s other switch terminal?

That’s correct. That white wire bundled with 3 black wires is your other switch common wire and it’s going into the Aeon micro switch terminal. The switch terminals are tiny and they recommend 18 gauge wire. So get them at homedepot for $0.30 a meter. RW90 18gauge stranded.

OK thanks again for all your help Ray. I’m gonna give it a shot, though I’m still not sure the micro switch will fit in the fixture box along with all the wires. I guess we’ll see!

Success!

I wired everything up according to the diagrams, then flipped the breaker back on. I can control the light from the ST app, as well as both switches in the three-way setup. Stuffing everything back into the fixture box was probably the toughest part; it was a very tight fit but I managed to cram everything in.

Turning the light on from the switch doesn’t seem to change the status in the ST app unless I hit “refresh.” I wonder if the aeon micro switch can be configured to instantly update its status when the switches are flipped? If not, I could try Pollster to keep it in sync.

Thanks @Navat604 and @Automated_House for all the help, I couldn’t have done it without your assistance.

The Aeon micros have a parameter setting that allows for instant status update. But you’d have to use a custom device type to change it, SmartThings doesn’t offer parameter changes in the standard UI.

I have 3 of these, I wasn’t aware of this and the paper manual doesn’t state it. Just gone downloaded the manual and can’t see it their either. Do you have any idea what the details are?

I don’t know much about groovy or any other coding. But if this is a z-wave light switch, then I guess there’s a way to add a line to a device handler that will let me edit the z-wave parameter for instant status update so that I can change it from within the ST app?

Parameter 80

https://www.domoticz.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7497

I believe @Mike_Maxwell may have used it with SmartThings, he’s mentioned it in the forums here:

Aeon Labs in-wall Micro controller capability? - #14 by Mike_Maxwell

@infofiend has also reported on it in the forums. He links to some documentation.

Aeon micro switch delays - #6 by infofiend

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cheers @JDRoberts will have a go tomorrow

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The device type made by @Mike_Maxwell works nicely. Updates status of light right away.

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cheers @marktheknife & @Mike_Maxwell i can confirm that this works on a EU Aeon G2 Micro Switch. these device were annoying me with their extremely slow update :slight_smile: all resolved. totally missed that this was available. :slightly_smiling:

Does this diagram stay the same for a single switch scenario? (with the exception of the traveler line and second junction box of course).

This is the same for a single switch with power going into the light fixture box first.