Automations Not Turning Off a Scene

I setup a couple of scenes to turn on several devices and dim to a certain level, I can test the scene and it runs fine, I can manually run a scene just fine. I setup an automation to trigger the scene on at a certain time and told the same automation to turn off at a certain time. All of the automations are turning on, but never turning off? I have the mode set for “Home” and that has been when the automations were running? Any suggestions what I am doing wrong?

I don’t think scenes can be “turned off”

A scene could consist of switching some lights on, some off, setting specific dim levels, etc. What would “off” mean?

@jdroberts always describes a scene as “a point in time”, IIRC.

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If I go setup an automation and have it trigger certain devices specifically, I can only set the dimmer level across the board on all those devices for that automation, and have different devices with various dimmer levels, so the only way I could find how to do that was setup a scene then run it, and use the ‘turn off’ when I wanted that scene to end, but I guess it doesn’t work that way?

Correct: It doesn’t work that way.

Think of a scene as a snapshot of the different devices that you put into that scene. That’s all it is. You might have lamp A at 25%, lamp B off altogether, and lamp C at 50%.

You can activate the scene, but you aren’t really turning it on and you can’t turn it off.

If you want to have the devices at different settings, just create a second scene with them at those settings. Even if your second scene is lamp A off, lamp B off, and lamp C off.

So a scene is not a group that turns on and off together. It’s just that moment in time with a specific list of devices each at a specific setting. If you want different devices or different settings, you need to use a different scene. :sunglasses:

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Thanks JD for the confirmation. I thought perhaps I was doing something wrong!

I have setup specific automations (not to trigger a scene), however turn on and dim certain devices, but the dimmer level appears to be across the board for all those devices within that automation.

Seems like there would be a way to setup a group of devices, on or off, separate dimmer levels, and then turn on and off as they were setup? Either manually or by an automation?

In the archives there are countless discussions of this Topic with well-thought recommendations by experienced developers. Alas, nothing of the sort was implemented.

I suspect that WebCoRE has the ability to save the State of a set of devices, and thus WebCoRE automations could be used instead of Scenes. But it’s a shame that a casual user needs to resort to such complexity for what could have been implemented as an intuitive concept.

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I agree —- well since I made my post today, I’ve learned this — and tested (so far, so good). You can setup an automation, tell it to trigger all the same devices ON that match the devices in the “scene”, and then select that scene, you can then set a TIME OFF in the automation, and it will work setting the specific dimmed lights at their individual settings and turn them all off at the set time.

The only issue I had with setting up an automation only (no scene) with several devices, was that I could not give them each an individual dimmer setting and had to be overall dimmer setting for all the devices in the automation. I tested the process above, and have it setup to run tomorrow morning for my basement routine when I get up for work on weekdays to have my morning espresso, news and check all my messages/alerts/notifications!

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UPDATE - unfortunately, it appears you cannot trigger certain devices on or off AND activate a scene in the same automation. I thought the routine was running my devices all the set to the scene dimmer levels, etc, however, after switching on a light or two outside of a routine or scene, when the automation ran the next time, it turned on the device to the dimmed level it was last turned on to — so I woke up to 100% bright recessed hallway light this morning instead of a dimmed 10% setting from the Scene.