I’ve been one of the fortunate ones who has not had enough significant issues with ST for the past year+ to make me want to complain. However, when the best thing that most experienced users can say is, “Yeah, but it doesn’t suck as badly as it used to” you still have serious problems with the way the platform is being managed.
Just looking at my Study (Man Cave), which is the smallest room in my house (Wasn’t my Choice), it is representative of most of my rooms where I go completely overboard with the HA. I just can’t help myself!
Alexa, play Oculus
Alexa, Watch a Movie on the Big Screen
Alexa, Turn on Airplace Simulator
Alexa, Turn on RaceCar Simulator
Alexa, Turn on Subwoofer
This is like a dream come true for me! I just speak it and it happens! Wish I could automate playing musical chairs in here as well for when it’s time to watch a movie.
There’s alot of automation going on in this room but the total cost, including the HUB is less than $200. You just can’t beat that!
Sure, but do you even need SmartThings for those use cases? It looks like you could do pretty much everything just with echo and harmony and an echo – controlled power strip.
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I’ll likely do the same, but it isn’t just a $75 purchase. If you have 200 devices averaging $20 each, that is $4,000.
I only use webCoRE and other community apps. I don’t use any of the standard ST apps. My issues used to be all my own (caused by me). Now, they are all ST related. The big outage we just had, devices falling off the network, secret firmware updates that drain your batteries. The Device Health joke.
[I call the last firmware update a secret because the reason they gave for an emergency rollout of a new firmware to all of their customers has to be untrue (as it didn’t justify the update) or whoever decided to approve it as an emergency got steamrolled.]
At first I thought your mancave sign said Webcore. Had to look a little closer
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I consider this an important point. Many folks are looking to have a massive automation with a single entry point. IMO it might not necessarily be feasible. For example, video. Yes the ST mobile app can display video from cameras around the house. But is it a good idea functionally? Does doing so tax the ST system/cloud beyond its designed capabilities?
Is it better, from the standpoint of having a solid and reliable home automation system, to view cameras in their own app/environment?
If me displaying video in my SmartThings mobile app puts no stress whatsoever on the overall system, then fine - let folks do whatever they wish. But if, say, the logging of the video device generates a never-ending stream of data that has to be stored somewhere, then perhaps video in ST should have some parameters around it?
I don’t have video in ST. Feel free to adjust my thinking on this.
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This is not accurate. We began overhauling he platform over a year ago. The transition mostly taken place. We are overhauling device and smartapp integrations but this is not going to result in an entirely new platform.
I have 62 devices currently connected to my ADT panel. I am in the process of adding more (I just moved) I will have well over 100 connected devices when I am finished replacing light switches.
I do work at SmartThing and I think we make a good product so “I” am probably biased. But my family isn’t and they would not tolerate it just because I happen to work here. I have 5 other people that live in my house and if it was an unreliable nightmare I am pretty sure the pitch forks would be sharpened and they would be after me.
Some things that contribute to reliability.
- I have a really robust networking setup. I use commercial grade network products from Ubiquiti.
- My Homeautomation gear is on its own vlan.
- I primarily use zwave devices.
- I don’t try to automate everything. Most of my family interacts with SmartThings via Alexa.
Please contact support and let them help you work through your frustrations. We have an awesome support team. If you have already done that and have open tickets, please PM them to me and I will have them escalated.
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To throw in my 2 cents worth.
I started out with ISmartAlarm a couple years ago. That system was apparently not going anywhere. So dropped that (Still have a cube 1 if anyone is interested) and went with IRIS. That system worked good but it’s flexibility was lacking. After waiting for some time for more flexibility it just wasn’t coming any time soon. So I again jumped ship (Still have a gen 2 hub if anyone is interested) and went with ST. That was a little over a year ago. There have been some glitches along the way but for the most part things have worked fine. Most of the problems have been my own mistakes.
I have about 75 devices. I use WebCore and now am writing some of my own SmartApps. Just for my own use. But the ability to be able to do this sort of complexity is what I really like. Reading a lot on these forums and researching other systems, there just doesn’t seem to be anything else that fits my needs. And I have too much money invested to change without a real compelling advantage.
So I can live with the occasional glitch, usually my own fault, and the better half doesn’t complain too much when it does happen.
So there is my 2 cents or maybe a dollars worth.
I completely agree with that statement. The reason I chose Z-wave for my switches is because it will work just fine w/o ST, or Vera, or any other controller. The reason I chose Phillips Hue bulbs for all lamps is because I can operate them in the Hue bridge, it works w/o ST. My camera system will be independent. I am setting up Harmony now, does not need ST. My AC system is controlled by Ecobee, without ST. My keypad door lock works if I press the buttons, or use the key.
SmartThings is not the central point of my HA, rather is is the binding force that brings everything together into once single app interface and gives out the instructions for each of my routines.
ST being down sucks, but all the other systems work just fine without it. Granted i just have to turn all the lights off by hand.
I do wish there was a way to assign Z-wave switches to a secondary controller. I like @JDRoberts approach of using Caseta, but changing out 50 light switches to Casetta is about as cost feasible as changing out 98 light bulbs to Phillips Hue.
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Thanks for the suggestions. I haven’t looked at my Zigbee vs. Wifi channels and will do that. Other than that, I disabled Device Health long ago. I know how to read the logs. I use WebCoRE to react to iPhone presence and it works perfectly. The idea of uninstalling and reinstalling all SmartApps is terrifying (kidding, mostly).
I have 40 WC pistons running pretty much flawlessly, I make extensive use of Ask Alexa (19 macros) and your ActionTiles. They work fine as long as the devices they use are working. The problem is pretty much exclusive to Zigbee devices. I’ve added repeaters and more devices but still experience constant failures. Whatever the problem is, it’s elusive. Things will work well for a few weeks and then it all falls apart and things don’t work for a few weeks. And that’s part of the problem. I am willing to troubleshoot, the other people in my home aren’t and they’ve started to hate the whole HA concept. When you get used to doing something a certain way, you get used to doing it that way and it’s frustrating when you have to do it “the other way.”
My new approach is to remove any device that’s repeatedly problematic and either replace it with a z-wave equivalent (when possible) or replace it with a dumb device. I may end up a less devices but they will be devices that hopefully work consistently. And as SmartThings evolves and other solutions become available, I’ll investigate the most appropriate approach to my HA needs. For now, It’s WebCoRE that keeps me here.
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A thousand times, this.
IMO, a lot of MS criticism was misguided and should have been aimed at smaller 3rd parties.
There are so many ‘compatible’ devices, you have to make sure you’re spreading the blame where it is warranted.
I chose ST because it reminded me of the good ol’ days before the term “ecosphere” became a technology buzzword and practice.
I also think I’ve had some luck… My house’s floor plan is compact. I went with Z-wave light switches and outlets first. (So I had a strong mesh before I added any z-wave locks.) And most of my sensors are WIRED from my old security system using the konnected.io solution, so that removes a lot of the wireless related issues with battery powered devices. I’d say my biggest frustration is my z-wave locks because they get less dependable commuicating all events as the batteries fade. But overall I can’t complain. ST has been a dependable hub integrating Z-wave, a few zigbees, Ring doorbell, Amazon Echos galore, Harmony Hub, an old school Roomba 530, some TP-Link wifi plugs, and a Sensi Wifi thermostat. (I’m also planning to integrate my 9 mySmartBlinds once I get their BT hub solution.)
I especially like that I’ve used the ST hub to coordinate my devices in ways I never imagined possible before I started tinkering with HA. It’s nice when your HA solution solves a problem that pops up on your radar.
Clearly, YMMV.
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What if I leave out and something is still on? This is how it all started. Got tired of paying higher than normal utility prices because after 20+ years of me and my family having bad habits, something had to change.
I am a certified wire freak. I live hooking things up. The issue is, once something is turned on, it’s almost certain it will stay on.
So yeah, Alexa can turn stuff on but ST turns them back off if not in use.
Worth the hassle.
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That’s a fair question. I was a die-hard Iris user and fan of the platform for almost 3 years. So much in fact that I used to actively blog about the system. When Lowe’s announced their second generation system, I was one of a small group of power users invited to participate in a “super-beta” group of their V2 hub. While the beta was conducted under NDA I cannot post specifics, I can say that only device pairing and basic device functions were tested, most of the time the system was idle while the devs worked in the background. The hub and devices were already on store shelves before the beta abruptly concluded and without testing a fully working system.
I continued to fight with V2 for 3 more months working closely with the support team until things became so bad I had no choice but to throw in the towel. How bad was it? Doors were unlocking at odd times, usually when nobody was home from “phantom rules”. Sirens frequently were going off in the middle of the night because the hub would spontaneously reboot. Devices would drop off daily, sometimes a dozen or more in a single day. Scheduled automations would fail more than they would succeed. Scenes never ran to completion. In one week alone, every single Zigbee device (80+) dropped off the system and had to be reset and re-paired. Twice.
I finally had it on one evening when I was in the process of removing a dead Z-Wave device but because of a known app UI issue, while the screen showed the device, it deleted the hub and all devices. 218+ devices gone in a blink, without so much as a warning dialog or anything. It was that moment I decided to give SmartThings a shot. Is SmartThings better overall? I think so. It’s more powerful, extensible, and open. These are areas which are important to me in but Iris is weak in. Is it more stable? Hard to say, I don’t use it anymore.
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Thanks Steve.
I’m not a fanboi. If something works I use it, if something doesn’t work I’m willing to look elsewhere. I will give some deference to what I already have online, since the pain of change can often outweigh the pain of staying.
You made clear to me one thing: my experience of SmartThings has been adventurous, interesting, and not without bits of pain… but on the aggregate, it WORKS. A couple moments (such as last week’s outage) aside, for me it works. Rules run as expected, stuff reports accurately, up-time is almost all the time. If there are issues with rules or automations not behaving as expected, almost all of them are my doing. I know that because I’ve fixed them - more than a few times with the assistance of this wonderful Community.
Based on a couple of these threads I’ve branched out to check the forums of other systems. And I see the same issues: devices not responding, rules not working, automations failing, integrations to other systems balking.
I would, at this point, have to see clear evidence of superior stability and interoperability in another system before I would consider making a switch and rebuilding all this stuff. It would also have to be compatible with ALL (or nearly all) my existing devices; I’m not seeking to spend hundred$ or thousand$ more, just to get marginally better reliability. It would have to be a drastic difference to make it worthwhile.
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Having read this from you and experienced it myself, this is by far the most friendly, helpful and knowledgeable HA community I have crossed. Don’t get me wrong - some very knowledgeable people in Homeseer and Vera and they will tell you—help you not so much.
This isn’t going to sound great, but it’s not meant as anything against you or the people at ST.
You do make a good product, the hub. In fact it’s great. However you have nothing else that is great. Your devices are subpar and over priced. Even if they were priced right, they don’t work as well as other and those batteries… they are almost impossible to change without damaging the device or yourself.
Your SmartApps are no where on the level of something like webCoRE. They might have been cool 3 years ago, but we want more. Without webCoRE leaving would be a heck of a lot easier.
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I mean…if I only spent $75…I’m afraid to look at my told HA spend since I started in 2010
Meaning, the investment for the ST Hub was small compared to the more professional offerings.
Of course my entire setup is way more but these are not proprietary devices and most can be migrated to devices that support z-wave and zigbee.
However, having the ability to add devices such as my DSC Alarm Panel by buying a $100 device and getting 28 hardwired devices or having the ability to add all of my PCs or having the ability to add my Harmony devices or having the ability to add Cameras or Doorbells or Thermostats and the list goes on…
The cost for the Hub coupled with User Created Rule Engines and DTHs for devices that cost a fraction of propriety devices makes HA affordable for people like me.
All I can go on is is cost savings and user experience.
Call me a Fanboy but seriously, all ST has gotten from me is the cost of the Hub and the cost of their horrible sensors until I knew better.
It’s a lot to take in when considering there is no monthly subscriptions or licensing fees but yet we still are getting updates and features added.
YMMV but I’m on board because the benefits outweigh the issues for me now.
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My hub just went offline again. Power cycle fixed it. Feeling like I am going to have to get a new hub. Worried…