Product Changes for 2017


(Jimmy) #21

Does no more Windows Phone OS mean no Windows UWP app? Or are those two different types of apps?


(Marc) #22

Why? They aren’t ending support on it. V2 is really no better than V1 as far as I am concerned as it has a lot of stability/firmware issues, leaky batteries, unreliable local processing and a bluetooth chip that has been useless. I will run my v1 hub into the ground until it either dies or ST cuts it off. By then, I hope there is a more mature/advanced alternative, whether that be v3, v4, etc.


(Bobby) #23

Well done on coming out clean! It’s a darn good start, now what’s the good news?


(Douglas) #24

Will you be providing refunds for Windows Phone users who can no longer use their hubs?


(Ron Talley) #25

And the good news is?


(Dana ) #26
  1. Some sort of backup/restore capability to allow replacement of a hub w/the same model in the event of a HW failure should be on your core list of requirements. In priority order for unfortunate event recovery right after a hub being able to power up normally after a power outage. Without that, you do not provide the most basic customer experience I would expect. This isn’t a weed wacker, it’s a cloud-connected device.

  2. The ability to migrate smoothly to newer versions of HW. Making it as hard to move a new version of your hub as it would be to abandon ST and move to another hub/system is a crazy business decision. If you don’t enable this you’re just asking competitors to come and get your customers over time.

Just my two cents.


(fightingmajor) #27

It’s nice that the post addressed a few issues that have been talked about. Would have been a nice opportunity to explain the delay of the extend while you had everyone’s attention.


(Realy Living Dream) #28

1 There are a few apps " highlighted" in the marketplace that I have long wondered " Why ?" . The functions are easily accomplished in SmartLighting. I do hope that removing them will allow room for the apps people need and use to be featured in the app marketplace so new users do not need to join the forum and learn IDE their first day.

I wouldn’t come back with "but Wink did it ". I will say the Hue bridge migration is simply a work of art. Plug old and new bridges into same network switch, open app, click on transfer all settings and devices, press the buttons on hubs then go make a cup of coffee and wait for it to say done.


(ocpd+adhd+alz+md+hfa+fms+lol=me :)) #29

I know you weren’t really ‘picking on’ SmartThings with that comment (so don’t take this that way either…just blabbing here), but…I can imagine at least part of the comeback to that would be to point out the vast difference between the Hue device type landscape, and that of SmartThings.


(ActionTiles.com co-founder Terry @ActionTiles; GitHub: @cosmicpuppy) #30

Bingo! This has been my genuine and well-intended concern since a long, long, long time before Hub V2 was even an egg. This isn’t animosity towards SmartThings; but rather, sincere empathy for Customers who experience a Hub failure!


I’m a Kickstarter backer and had a Hub V1 failure rather early (i.e., the power connector surface mount failure), and had an absolutely wonderful “above-and-beyond” experience with SmartThings sending a replacement overnight (plus a generous surprise gift).

At the time, I didn’t have a lot of devices or configured SmartApps, but, indeed, I had to migrate them by hand. Firstly, Customer Support was again excellent in helping me through the Z-Wave exclusion step on a couple things that got “stuck”.

But… after I was happily up and running again, I suddenly had a realization and a deep sense of future panic: What if my Hub (only V1 existed, remember) fails again once I have invested in many more devices and created complex SmartApp configurations? Despite overnight shipping, will I have to face a “dumb home” until I get sufficient free time to manually migrate? It turns out, indeed, that was true, still is true, and will be true for the foreseeable future, even with Hub V2.

Luckily, I haven’t had another hub failure… in fact, I’m still on my, once replaced, Hub V1.


Honestly, I’m no longer “complaining” about this. It is what it is. This announcement today should perhaps include a warning that the lack of a migration tool (even a partial “back-end migration”) also affects any unpredictable, though rare, need for a Hub replacement. :scream:


(Dana ) #31

@RLDreams - that sounds like what I would expect (the Hue) experience for migrating hub-to-hub when both hubs are extant - thanks for confirming that exists. If Hue also has a way to recover when the original hub has died, that is a complete solution.


(Tim Slagle) #32

No, This is only refering to “officially” published SmartApps in the Mobile App Marketplace.

Yes. To give you a little insight so you can understand why this decision was made… 0.001% of our user base uses WIndows Phones. We just can’t justify a software engineer for that small of a user base.

They also use a custom ZigBee stack and they only have to deal with one type of a device. :slight_smile: Not to say that these are the only reasons they can do it and we can’t but it sure makes it easier.


(Geko) #33

Still no word on Gear S2/3 app and the SmartTV dongle. Both were announced over a year ago. Questions are being asked every day and not a single official comment.

Very disappointing news indeed. :frowning:


(Realy Living Dream) #34

I haven’t had a Hue Bridge die yet, so can’t verify.

Oh I debated even saying / comparing Hue bridge with St Hub because I fully expected to be ducking knives and other implements of deathly injury


(George A Roberts IV) #35

Tim,

Then how about you bring on a developer from the Windows developer community who also is a SmartThings user (such as myself) to take over development. I would do it in a heartbeat and I’d do it for free.

You could even caveat it that it’s a “community-developed” and unsupported by SmartThings but authorized so that people know that the app has authorized access to SmartThings. And if the usage patterns change over time and people are using the Windows app enough and you want to bring it back in house, that’s cool too.

Serious offer, let me know.

George


(Kurt Sanders) #36

Dear @slagle,

I read the “tea leaves” on ST Engineering failing to provide on their promise to us early adopters of a V1->V2 hub migration utility. I went ahead and manually upgraded my V1 hub to V2 over 10 grueling days. Soon after, the instability of the SmartThings backend outages, unreliable scheduler, database reorganizations/expansions were a weekly occurrence. The help desk/technical support staff email and chat lines were swamped and appeared all but absent. Seems like ST engineering also back burnered promises for V2 bluetooth connectivity, USB wireless hub connectivity, and more local device/App processing being delivered.

Since those difficult times and many improvements in SmartThings backend (YEA), I have doubled my home sensors and migrated from Bruce’s Rule machine to a more robust CoRE platform. I still have quite a few custom smartApps with OAuth & REST endpoints and they are finally stable (I am knocking on wood).

I can tell you that I will think twice before considering any adoption of a ST’s V3 version. I cannot imagine what features or incentives there would be offered for me to manually migrate without a means of easily importing my existing ST defined devices, Apps and device drivers.

Over the years, I have come to balance my love-hate relationship with SmartThings. I still believe that Samsung/SmartThings has one of the best home automation platforms for which new users to invest without any monthly fees. But all that could change with a new company that offers a means to easily migrate existing devices or deliver on features that customers require. Let’s hope that Samsung/SmartThings can keep up the pace and not make the same mistakes that other “one hit wonder” companies like Palm Pilot, Blackberry, etc…

Thanks again for your communication and support over the years @slagle… we have come a long way together through quite a few stormy releases and you have been there to help us when we are frustrated.


(Richard Pope) #37

What he said

I can understand that you might not want to open source it, but you could “recruit” a bunch of windows developers who will do it for free and even have some sort of contract with them for any NDAs and such

Windows 10 Mobile may be 0.001% of your current user base, but i’m willing to bet pretty serious money that if it was a UWP app rather than a phone only app that % would increase quite substantially pretty quickly!


(Steve White) #38

Windows Phone is dead so that announcement does not come as a surprise. UWP is more of a myth as tablet and PC apps are easy to design but the smaller screen size of a phone is not. Amazon and Roku both released UWP apps that did not include WP.

I just don’t understand the lack of a migration tool or how and why it was promised for so long. Wink, as others have mentioned released one, and so did Lowe’s for the Iris V1 system. Both of those platforms combined are likely a fraction of SmartThings market share.

What would be very helpful, although highly unlikely, is in addition to being told what we won’t be getting, how about a look at what will be happening? It’s easy to see how the community’s confidence has been shattered over the past couple years. A little restorative gesture of trust would go a long way right about now.


(Wayne) #39

If we could get a mass storage device working on the hub, surely it should be trivial to dump an image onto a USB stick as backup right? This would be a good compromise as a tool to restore broken hubs even if it doesn’t give us a migration tool.


(Geko) #40

Wow! What a load of carp. You can’t find an engineer who has both Windows and Android skills so (s)he could work on both platforms?! Stunning! What happened to “now we got full backing of Samsung and all the resources we need” tune?