It is a pain, but I can get it on having wifi devices needing to be updated. What I can’t understand is why smart switches and so on that use z-wave and zigbee now will end up being in that mess of things too. It’s already really good as it is, but they don’t want it that way anymore to have a nice hub that’ll connect to everything like a V2/3. Again, I was buying Matter devices like I said with those bulbs in case this dropped of the good protocols happened.
Having everything directly connected to the wifi router is such a pain, having all the ‘IOT’ stuff on their own hub is so much better. Just support Z-wave and this wouldn’t even be an issue really.
Don’t understand what you mean. Zwave and zigbee devices are paired with your hub (SmartThings) , they don’t use WiFi in any respect. My Aeotec hub is connected to my home network via Ethernet and is entirely independent of WiFi. Changing broadband provider has zero impact on my smart home network. This isn’t just in theory it’s in practice too. I changed internet broadband provider last year and had zero effort to reconfigure my smart home.
Yes, but those bulbs I listed above, are connected directly to my router with Matter. They also show up in my smartthings app. I know it’s a confusing mess, but those bulbs now are wifi devices really.
I know all hub devices are interchangeable with any router/isp, but these matter light bulbs don’t work that way. Maybe those are just some weird application of Matter devices, but it seems that’s common that they connect directly to wifi so need those credentials but also work in smartthings amid the other stuff.
You are mixing things. Matter is how to control the device, then there’s how it connects: WiFi, Thread, Ethernet, bridges…
Your lights are Matter over WiFi, of course they connect to your WiFi router. If you had Matter over Thread lights they would not connect to your WiFi router but to your SmartThings hub using Thread, which is more similar to how Zwave or ZigBee work.
Well ok, I kinda got that figured out I think. So we have multiple things connecting to hubs directly (thread, Z-wave, Zigbee), and then Matter to wifi. Then I hear about Matter over Thread, or is it Thread over Matter?
Why is so complicated? Above all, what devices now are even sold at all that are ‘Thread’ only that connect that way to replace Zigbee and Z-wave entirely with this ‘new and improved’ thing?
Guess the joke’s on me for think ‘Matter’ was some sort of new standard, but now it’s ‘Thread’ over Matter? In 2 years it’ll be Jedi mind trick over wifi10 to keep up I suppose.
Can anyone find reasonably priced Thread light bulbs that won’t have to deal with this nastiness of Matter to Wifi?
matter determines the format of the message being sent. But there’s still a transport protocol that is carrying that message. In this case thread. You can also have matter over Wi-Fi. Or for non-matter, transport protocols, Zwave, Zigbee, Bluetooth, etc.
In the usual post office analogy, the transport protocols are the trucks carrying the letters, and the communication protocol (matter in this case) is the check box form inside the envelope.
To me it’s like having 20 delivery people riding in the USPS car to deliver a package. It makes no sense all these protocols And it’s more like having 10 guys per UPS truck and Fedex and Amazon truck that’ll deliver in sep trucks
With Z-wave, Zigbee, it wasn’t all these weird things. I now have these 'new fangled Matter bulbs’. They aren’t Thread though if I want to change wifi credentials.
How did it end up getting so amazingly impossible for anyone not totally technical to deal with? It’s just getting worse.
All I want to know, if what do I have to spend another thousand or more bucks on to be a long term smart home protocol that will work multiple platforms and not need endless credential resets on a router whim.
That seemed like Z-wave and Zigbee to me, but the tech giants seem to hate those, so what is the coming thing, this thread stuff?
First of all, I think the Matter/Thread stuff is going to be great. Some day. It’s still experiencing growing pains, IMHO, and being a Z-Wave only home I’m going to stick with it for now.
With an all Z-Wave house I wanted neither the expense or the aggravation of migrating stuff to a platform that might not be ready for prime time. (Again, I think it has promise and will probably get there just fine. Look how long it took Z-Wave to go from the original versions to the 800 Long Range stuff available today. And now the licensing costs are minimal and the chipsets are available. I just don’t feel comfortable upsetting the household with something that requires constant tweaking to keep running as others in the household expect it to do.)
That being said, both of my SmartThings hubs have been retired and I migrated my existing devices to the Zooz Z-Box Hub–which, incidentally, has Long Range support. I have been happy with the move (the hub isn’t updated/changed nearly as often and isn’t trying to connect to my televisions, dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, and anything else with the Samsung label). It is stable and “just works” as intended–and Z-Wave Long Range is great!
If I had more time, it might have been Home Assistant–which gets pretty high marks, but requires more technical savvy to get running.
That’s just how it looks from here today. You have options, @Monty2_2001, and probably don’t need to rush into it if your present configuration works well enough. Again, I’ll probably eventually get into Matter devices some day–just not gonna be forced into it. Too many other things to do and what I have “just works!”
Will those matter bulbs I have and z-wave devices be included in your great future of things that’ll be all included and moved into the new way of things?
Ideally we can take all our devices and move them to one or another, I thought that was what Matter was trying to be, but nahhh, they’lre gonna make you buy all new equipment and suffer aren’t they.
it sounds like us suckers that invested $1000’s are gonna have to invest more $1000’s into this new ‘future proof setup’
I’m sure they won’t say there’s a ‘thread 2.0’ and all your old stuff has a limited lifespan.. right?
Matter 1.4.2 is fully backward compatible with all previous releases (1.0 - 1.4.1), so existing devices continue to work as before, even as the standard adds new features. The same with the upcoming Matter version 1.5.
By the way: Z-Wave guarantees backward compatibility by design (it’s mandatory), so even the newest 800-Series devices work seamlessly with much older models from the 300, 500, and 700 Series. Zigbee 3.0 follows the same principle, remaining compatible with earlier versions like 1.0, 1.2, allowing legacy devices to keep working…
I’m sure they won’t say there’s a ‘thread 2.0’ and all your old stuff has a limited lifespan.. right?
… Same with Thread 1.4, by supporting all earlier versions (1.1, 1.2), ensuring older devices stay functional in new mesh networks.
Yeah, that’s great an all, but I still have to reset and reconnect all devices with matter to wifi connection, unlike if I were to swap a hub. Sucks don’t it?
I guess that’s my entire complaint with all this, you should be able to swap SSID and Wifi password without issue. With Zigbee and Z-wave devices plugged in,no problem right? With Matter, big huge nasty problems.
This isn’t a matter specific issue, you would have exactly the same problem if you wanted to change ssid with your laptop, tv, iPad, mobile phone, car, anything else that connects to WiFi.
You can keep the same SSID and password with a new router , or WiFi access point. It’s like changing the lock to your front door and complaining the existing keys don’t work.
I would not have that problem if it was any of the good ol’ non-wifi things like z-wave and zibgee, which was my entire point. Right? Somehow that seems to be beyond the ability for many to understand that the wifi direct sucks and a hub for them is great like it has been.
