Rule machine - as per the app developer, this app is no longer available for new installs, distribution, or support

I read @Myles_Gray 's querie to have that extra layer of complication:

Hence the use of a virtual switch to keep track of order of operation.

Maybe I read his “Need” wrong, but that’s how I understand it.

This is what any 2 condition rule does. As he stated it, he simply wants both to occur before taking action. Either happening by itself will not cause such a rule to act.

Bruce - Okay, the issue I see with that is if he is present already then presence sensor = present. But then someone else comes home and opens the door. Then the rule becomes TRUE and it take the action, when myles may not want it to.

So, if myles ONLY wants it to take that action when his presence sensor FIRST becomes present then shortly thereafter the door opens… then he needs more logic.

That’s my read of it. Hence my post:

Seems to be simple…on first blush…

Trigger = Presence Sensor: Present
Condition= Contact Sensor: Open

But, given you want this to only work if they happen in that specific order, and I assume in quick succession…

Then I would create a simulated switch / virtual switch. When the presence sensor becomes present and door is closed, have rule machine turn on the simulated switch and automatically (delay off) it after 2 minutes or some acceptable variable.

Second rule would be:
Trigger: Contact Sensor = Open
Condition: Simulated Switch = On
ACTION

@Myles_Gray - can you clarify what your needs are? I interpreted it the same way JH1 did.

1 Like

You’re putting words in his mouth. I simply was trying to point out that a rule with 2 conditions meets what he said. Certainly, you can have more complicated things going on if there are additional presence sensors, etc. “shortly thereafter” is meaningless.

I was on 1.6.6

I will update and report back.
thanks!!

Not trying to put words in his mouth, and certainly have not misquoted him. I am very clear that this is MY interpretation of his post and his need - and I went out of my way to be uber clear about that.

Anyway… that’s my attempt to help. Hopefully it suits @Myles_Gray 's need.

Maybe…
If you Hue bulbs are controlled by an Aeon microswitch, you could create a custom command in RM that utilizes the Aeon’s hardware-based flash/strobe/blink function. Aside from Rule Machine, there is also the purpose-built “The Flasher” smartapp, available from the IDE.

I created a rule pretty much identical to your Bad one, and I cannot get it to fail. So I don’t know what was going on with that for you…

@bravenel - did I miss something in this very active thread?

I had to recreate a rule today, and for some reason, ‘Pending off’ is no longer an option for True or False actions?

It’s in the “Delay these actions” section at the very top of the actions page.

So, just so I’m clear, the previous ‘Pending off’ (i.e. - cancel/restart the delay timer if motion detected again) is now Delay by xx min, Cancel on truth change?

Clearly, I haven’t had to change that rule since I created it way back when, but I just had to upgrade that sensor to a Multisensor 6 today, so the rule had to get removed and recreated.

Thanks.

@bravenel I don’t have a clue what I did wrong.
These 2 went off when I left this afternoon.

That is correct… 2020

1 Like

Cool - thanks Bruce… One of these days, when I get some copious free time (ha!), I really want to put together that FAQ/mini doc set (based on what you already have) to address just these kinds of things…

I know we have that other thread on rule logic, but to someone new coming into RM, diving through these threads for answers can get problematic…

A new project for 2016! :smile:

I sent you a private message. Please reply to that.

Seriously! I have an idea what your problem may be. Click on your own icon top right of this page.

There is a basic Wiki page here: http://thingsthataresmart.wiki/index.php?title=Rule_Machine

Perhaps that would be a good place for this type of stuff.

1 Like

I couldn’t agree more. Although, no one seems to actually read things anymore. Many of the ways that people mess up their rules are because they obviously didn’t read the documentation. They dive into the app with their own assumptions about how it works, which are sometimes wrong, and then it doesn’t work, and they can’t figure out why.

I predicted that this was going to happen when I integrated triggers into rules. But, I thought the app was incomplete without the integration, and there were many types of automations that were out of reach without it. Now, those things are doable, but the price is confusion by those who don’t read.

I think what would be really good are some core use case examples. Things like motion controlled lights, arriving home or leaving, etc. These are very common.

3 Likes

I think this is a great idea.

Not sure if this is just my installation or just by design but wanted to let you know incase something needs to be looked at. If I go into Delay these Actions screen I initially have 3 options, Minutes of Delay, Seconds of Delay, and then Milliseconds of Delay. I put in a value then have to click Done which brings me back a screen, I then have to select Delay these Actions again to see the next two options Cancel on truth change? and Random Delay?

I can confirm that behavior on Android as well - just ran into it setting up a new rule for one of my upgraded multi sensors… Bruce - is this submitOnChange rearing it’s ugly head or something else?

Thanks.