Presence sensor in new ST app

I see in the new ST app that all my presence sensors are in my Smart Lighting app just like it is in my Classic ST app.

Does this mean they are actually in the New app or are they just pulling from the Classic app?

Is there anything else I need to do?

They are in both apps. You can also use automations in tHe new app to manage presence.

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The apps are just a window into the same back end system. Nothing is actually moving back and forth.

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Do I need to do anything with my presence sensors before the Classic app is sunset?

When you move to NewApp. (probably through migration) it will walk you through upgrading. Butnas I’m sure youve read here its hit or miss.

I did mine manually which includes:

Disabling location in classic and ensure the old presence devices are deleted.
Convert the routines you want tonuse presence in to automations in new app or delete them entirely and recreate them as automations.
Enable location service in NewApp.
Add member location to your new automation as a trigger.


So is the Smart Lighting app going away? I have a ton of stuff in there for when I leave and arrive, things turn on/off.

Also, how do I disable location in Classic?

I have multiple users on the Classic app which I also see in the new app through apps, what do I do with their presence sensors? They are only logged into the Classic app on their phones and they have not installed the new app on their phones yet.

When I migrated, nothing was brought up about presence sensors. Currently on the new app, “get your location from this phone” is off.

If the apps are just a window to what’s going on in the back end, why do I need to delete “old presence sensors” in the Classic app if I see them in both apps? Aren’t they the same sensor?

This is super confusing .

The location sensor is one of the few exceptions. The app itself is the sensor. So when you delete Classic… Poof there goes the sensor ot was controlling.

Smartlighting isnt going away anytime soon - at least not as part of this migration. It will later with the IDE retirement next year but lets worry about one thing at a time.


Thanks for your patience with me. You have been super helpful.

So if I delete my Classic app off my phone, will my Smart Lighting automations not show my presence sensor in the new app, or do I just turn on “get your location from this phone”?


If you delete the classic app off the phone:

Everything stays exactly they way it is configured (its all in the cloud) AND the legacy (read: classic) presence sensor stops getting updated because its updates were controlled by the classic app…

So if Smartlighting was running presence off of that old legacy sensor, Smartlighting will effectively stop responding to location.

To fix it you need to enable presence in NewApp (settings, enable location on this phone) that will create a sensor named something like (yourname - your device) then you will need to go into Smartlighting and replace your old (classic) presence sensor with the newapp presence sensor then save it.

I’d also go delete the old classic presence sensor just to eliminate confusion.


Awesome, I get it now. Just did it with my phone so I’ll have to do it with my other users.

Can you explain what the precondition means?

I have had this good morning scene in the Classic app which migrated to the new app.

I don’t understand why the mode is home and night…

Precondition means “this/these mode(s) have/has to be true BEFORE I even bother processign the rest of this rule”

So if your phone flips presence to home you could have a precondition of ‘away’ before the rule triggers.

Warning - people are reporting that rules with preconditions are ‘buggy’

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So I take it that my scene didn’t migrate correctly because “night mode” had nothing to do with my good morning scene from Classic.

So I added the new app to one of my users phones and tried selecting their new presence sensor and deselecting the old presence sensor in one of my existing automations.

It gives me “NETWORK ERROR couldn’t add automation”.

I already did the same with my presence sensor and it worked.

Why is it not working now for a user?

I figured it out. I tried deleting the automation and created it again - it worked.

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In the classic app, I had an option to choose something like “when someone arrives” and then choose my presence sensor.

I am not seeing that in the new app.

Let’s say I want to unlock my door when I arrive home. I’m using life360 btw.

In the new app, It only says when “presence sensor” is present, unlock the door. How does ST know that I only want to unlock the door when I first arrive home and not keep it unlocked all day whenever I am home?

Does adding a member mean they also get notifications, and have account access?

Or is this simply a presence, that they’ve now decided to call a ‘member’?

There is nothing constantly evaluating the conditions on an automation. Like all apps on ST, automations run in response to subscribed events. As your automation is interested in presence events it will subscribe to those events and run when they occur. It can then decide if it needs to do anything.

The actual problem you can have is when there is more than one person in the house and all are tested in the automation. Each arrival will result in someone being present, and so will departures that leave someone behind.

I’m not getting it. I have the ST presence fobs unlocking doors for me. I want the system to continue to do that.; it’s the primary reason I got ST to begin with.

I use an iPad to run the ST apps (old and new). It comes with me to work, on vacation… I do not want the location of that iPad (which lacks gps/cell capabilities) to determine whether the presence fobs unlock my front door.

I simply want the hub to continue to interact with the fobs to control whether a returning fob unlocks a door , turns on a light, etc.

Will it do that? Without setting up a ‘member’, locating the iPad, etc?

Sadly it does.

If only …

Adding the ability to add members just for notifications and/or presence would be a massive win for ST. A mobile phone has massive potential as a multi-capability ST device. Unfortunately it has been burdened with doing all the stuff that really belongs on the web.

They still work fine. The new app has shifted the native mobile presence into ‘Member location’ but left other presence sensor devices such as the arrival sensors to still be handled as ‘devices’.