My Non ST Adventure (2018)

Thanks for this excellent post! I’m new to ST just been using it a couple of months for some plugs and switches and so far mostly very pleased. The outages are concerning but so far have had little impact on me - some have occurred when I was at work, in one case tho ST said it was offline I was still able to control everything w/my Echo. That said the benefits of local control are obvious. Based on your experience, which local system would you recommend? Or are they all really not ready for Prime Time?

@joecooler, I just started this little research project. I’m going to be continuing to add edits and updates to the original posting as I learn more. I have not yet received my Vera hug it’s scheduled to be delivered today. Once I go through that setup I’ll update as I go. I do have SmartThings setup and has been for a while now, and I have Home Assistant and Hubitat also running in parallel. The wink hub as stated is sitting in a pile in my office area :slight_smile:

Don’t have thorough knowledge on other systems but I used to use Wink without the hub when I had only Sensi thermostat and Chamberlain garage door and Philips hue. I even tried to get a wink relay when they’re on sale on Amazon but it was defective and their support told me it’s an old product and would not work as a hub.

So far my observation with ST vs. Wink is like, Wink is just being very “Apple” when it comes to platform, you either buy the devices they support or leave it, and you don’t even have the ability to tinker it a bit. While ST is just like Android, you have full control of your system and full of customization optics, but reliability is a thing (although Android is no longer unreliable today).

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one question did you try to run two systems in parallel, or disconnect one and go to a new one then back later.

i have about 136 devices (in one location) and got my hubitat but don’t want to start moving everyting till all works, like alexa, honeywell therm, and harmony, garage door openers etc. ineed to do some reasearch to see what is working…


@JDRoberts, so you have one of those fancy “blended” households? :wink:

Honestly, I’m in the same type of situation. I have so many different smart home products that sometimes I feel like they are cobbled together with nothing more than string and duct tape (because come on, who doesn’t LOVE duct tape?!). Between my Hue hubs, my ST hub, various smart lights, switches, outlets, plugs, thermostats, Harmony hubs, etc etc etc. It’s crazy when I think about just how much I have really spent on my smart home.

However, with that said, I was FINALLY able to ditch my Wink hub a few weeks ago. I was using it for 1 power strip (the Quirky powerstrip) that I just couldn’t urge myself to replace. I finally did 2+ hours of crawling in the attic to get to it and replaced it with a proper smart outlet.

As for the Wink2 hub, I gifted it to a friend who is just starting out and broke, so he’s a happy guy (until he sees just how horrid Wink truly is compared to ST).


@Lgkahn, Yes currently I have 4 different systems all running in parallel.

  • Home Assistant
  • SmartThings
  • Hubitat
  • Vera Plus Advanced

I have SmartThings and Hubitat sending events to an MQTT server and Home Assistant is reading those events and displaying their status. This is a bi-directional link, so I can control the devices through Home Assistant as well.

I have recently setup the Vera system and I am just now getting some things moved over to it for my testing. I’ll update my post with finding.

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@Core_Phx, I’ve thought about gifting my Wink Hub 2… but do I really want to be that cruel? :wink:

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Any more updates for the Hubitat? I am waiting for confirmation that they are ready to take over from SmartThings. $$ is burning my pocket. :wink:

That all depends on your own requirements and perspective. Check your devices against their known devices and then check what rules you have setup. The progress of getting WebCore ported and working is going VERY well.

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What questions do you have specifically regarding Hubitat?

I have everything running on Hubitat except my Ring Doorbell. I have ST forwarding Ring Motion Events to Hubitat while I wait for native Hubitat-Ring integration.

Hubitat has recently added a web-based Dashboard, Sonos integration, Text to Speech, Philips Hue Bridge integration, IFTTT integration, Rachio Sprinkler integration, plus support for many zigbee and z-wave devices. It also has Alexa integration, Life360 integration, and Rule Machine.

There are also many user contributed solutions available as well (e.g. my HubDuino integration for DIY microcontrollers like the Arduino and ESP8266/ESP32.) webCoRE is also running fairly well for many users.

If you can tell me that all of these products connect and work with your hub Now; I am going to place an order right this minute. Because these are all in my house.

And the Xiaomi Original motion sensors too.

Great topic. I have also been researching alternatives as the ST app has become very slow to respond (have over 140 devices) among other issues …

Zigbee is a must for me as i have too much invested in zigbee sensors and fan controllers, hence HomeSeer, Control4 and the big boys were scratched off the list right away…

Looked at most of the above along with OpenHab … Just gave up on and OpenHab as my Nortek zwave/zigbee stick kept failing to stay connected (tried both RPI and a Desktop PC)…

There is also a new kid on the block, Mixtile, and i’m waiting on my pre-order to deliver and will be giving it a try. Not sure if it will be better/more stable than ST…

Maybe a ST hub 3 (one hopes it gets released soon…) or Hubitat once they release a more stable device and Mobile client would be my best options…

I can’t tell you everything works that you have listed, since I do not own many of those devices.

You can create an account on the Hubitat Forum and start searching/reading regarding each of your devices.

Also, take a look at this WiKi post as it lists devices known to be working



You need to know that Control4 is all Zigbee…

Homeseer has limited Zigbee support. It does have full Hue capabilities with the JowiHue plugin and it does work with DeConz for additional Zigbee support. I’m actually using my Vera Plus hub for a Zigbee device controller and integrated it with Homeseer.

I have the Nortek usb stick as well… 2 actually I haven’t had any problems with it. Hubitat uses the same USB stick.

I have not looked into Mixtile and at this point probably won’t. I don’t think ST will ever fully be local which is what a lot of people want once they have more than a handful of devices controlling their homes and family happiness.

Hubitat from my experience is quite stable. There’s always some bumps from firmware updates but otherwise that’s normal with all systems.


Control4 is zigbee, But they use a proprietary profile, so sensors which you have bought to use with smartthings probably won’t work with control4, and vice versa. Manufacturers usually put out a separate control4 compatible model.

Absolutely correct. The C4 devices are not compatible with Non C4 systems. However…there are ways to get Non C4 devices to work with C4…just saying… but it is kinda a hack and really if you can afford C4 then you can afford to just buy new sensors.


thanks… Might have been the ZWAVE side with C4… don’t remember, its been a while since i looked at them…

I could just give up all my HA devices and start fresh if i really wanted to go down the route with C4 or Savant or one of the big guys (may add another $3-4K to the mix…)

I will look at Hubitat again…

I bought a Hubitat and am in process on transitioning - but it will be a while before I rely on Hubitat. I need to learn how to better use the dashboard to support the many functions of some of my devices.

I have succeeded in porting my self-developed apps and device handlers to Hubitat and they are up and running as I babble on here. But I still need to work out the Sensi Thermostat and Ring Doorbell to get complete.

Thoughts. It is VERY FAST in local mode. I have had to put delays in some command streams on the Samsung Speakers to avoid collisions, but still VERY FAST!


I started out with SmartThings, but am just finishing up transitioning to HomeSeer. I also have a Hubitat, but HomeSeer is proving to be much more robust. It’s not cheap, but as noted, you get what you pay for.

If you are only going to control a couple of devices, setting up a dedicated PC running the HomeSeer software doesn’t make sense - but if you have a large implementation (I have 60+ devices), then the cost of the software to make all that pricey hardware work the way you want it doesn’t seem so out of line.

I’ve come to the same conclusion with the HomeSeer switches and sensors. They are not the cheapest, but work really well and have a feature set that is hard to find elsewhere.