Matter - smart home connectivity standard (formerly Project CHIP)

Which part do you think is accurate and which wrong?

I have the same feeling about the whole hype around Matter. It is going to cause more confusion than solution. Wifi (Ethernet), Bluetooth, Zigbee, Thread… ie.: It is Matter compatible but you need a Bluetooth hub to use it… Where is the promised interoperability when some shares, some does not the devices with other controllers.

The article just sums up that really nothing will change compared to what was before.

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I was never under the impression atter would get rid of hubs/bridges. There is after all a specific Matter cert for bridges. I also never expected Matter to reduce everything to one app, only give me choice of which app I wanted to use. He says Aqara will require an updated hub, which isn’t true. Their new hub only adds Thread support and existing hubs will get a firmware update to add Matter support.

I do agree onboarding Matter devices to various controllers is clunkier than I expected. I wish once a Matter device was setup with one controller other controllers would automatically discover it, but maybe that’s a security concern? I also agree with him their is still some siloing with all companies not playing nice exposing their devices (aka Samsung).

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Reading the article and the updated part, I have a feeling PR people had no clue about what they’re trying to sell, and what promises they can make.

Regarding the one app, what you are saying is actually is one app. The one you choose. That’s the point of a standard. Pairing a Zigbee lightbulb should be the same process disregarding the Zigbee controller and the app of the Zigbee controller should not matter, because they all should use the same language, what Matter dictates.

But one of the most interesting point what the author makes, is the Internet dependent Border Routers. It just sounds like the biggest oversight in the whole story of Matter.

That is as much stupid as having a network router which starts to reboot if the internet connection goes down.

The thread border router will continue to work without internet, as long as it has power. So IMO it doesn’t matter if my border router is a simple device like an Eve Energy outlet or its buried inside an internet connected device like an Amazon Echo. Alexa may not work without internet, but my Thread network will still be up and running.

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As @Automated_House said, the fact that many smart speakers use the cloud doesn’t mean all their functions do.

Just as one example, even without Matter, the Amazon echo devices that have a Zigbee hub inside work just fine to control those devices without internet. In fact, you even get limited voice control of them. I would think Thread would work the same way.

I use Alexa “local processing” for a few Zigbee switches in my own home as my backup voice control. :sunglasses:

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I believe both Amazon and Google have committed to local voice control for Matter devices, too.

I hope so. It’s harder than it sounds, as Amazon has discussed previously, not the control part, but the processing natural language part.

Amazon has been investing a lot into that, separately from matter, but I haven’t seen anything that said Google had been doing the same.

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New video from Everything Smart Home about Matter.

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Currently it just says, “I can’t reach the Internet”.

And what about app control? Is that working at all?

The author misunderstood Thread Border Routers, didn’t fact-check the claims with anyone at Thread (it seems), and then published it anyways. :frowning: Clearly, it’s had some impact as it’s been shared here now, too.

  1. Thread Border Routers are a local function. They can be bundled into cloud-based devices, but that doesn’t mean the Border Routing requires the cloud. It’s illogical: Thread Border routers connect a local Thread network with a Local Area Network (LAN) and that’s all they do.
  2. All Thread Border Router-containing products just need to be setup and then they’ll function as Thread Border Routers indefinitely. They are not dependent on the cloud to route between a local Thread network and a LAN. Claiming the HomePod Mini is the “only” Thread Border that doesn’t use the cloud is wrong: all Thread Border Routers do not use the cloud for the border routing.

I mean, our own SmartThings V3 hub will become a Thread Border Router.

The salient point—and what the author should’ve focused on—is that Thread 1.3.0 specification has only just released, so it will take time for 1.3.0 Thread Border Routers to launch.

The Cloud Will Still Invade Your Home

And Matter really does offer local control—until it doesn’t. Think about it for a second. To get a local Matter network going, the first step is to add a device that serves as a Corder control router to your home. The nicety here is, it will probably be a device you’d buy anyway, so at least it serves double duty unlike traditional hubs.

But look at that Thread Border Router list again, and you’ll find something in common. Nearly all of them are Cloud-based devices. Whether it’s an Alexa or Google speaker, or even an eero or Nanoleaf (which won’t work anyway), you’re bringing the Cloud into your Matter smart home. The main exception above is Apple’s products, which do skip the Cloud. If your whole family isn’t on iPhone, you’re out of luck though if you want to avoid the Cloud.

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So the WiFi Hub (Mesh) will never become a Thread Border Router according your descriptions, as it is unable to work as a LAN router without Internet (cloud).

What you stated in your second point regarding Thread and LAN. That is literally what not Samsung states about Matter support, as being able to share devices with other systems.

It’s not planned for the Samsung mesh wifi products to get a Thread update. Only V3/Aeotec and the TV/Fridge Zigbee dongle.

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I don’t know what will happen with the SmartThings WiFi hubs, but so far the only hubs that are scheduled to be updated with Thread are the SmartThings V3 and the Aeotec clone of the V3.

As for the other: it is very important to remember that Thread and Matter are two different things. A Thread Border Router (TBR) just bridges Thread messages to WiFi. (Not necessarily to the internet; it could just be a local WIFi.) It’s not technically a hub.

What Samsung has said is the a V3 hub WILL be a TBR, but will NOT be a “Matter Bridge.” Two different things. It will pass along messages from other devices using thread and bridge them to your WiFi network. It will NOT be able to add Zigbee devices connected to it to another company’s Matter compatible app.

In contrast, the Philips Hue Hub will NOT be a TBR, but WILL be a Matter Bridge. it won’t help your Thread network at all, but it can be added to another company’s Matter compatible app and it will bring a lot of devices along with it. (Very much like it does with its integrations today.)

So, two scenarios.

SCENARIO A: Smartthings V2 plus Hue plus Eve sensor

Say you have a v2 hub (which is not a TBR) , a Hue hub (also not a TBR) and an Eve door sensor using Thread. The Hue hub can be added to SmartThings using Matter, and it will bring many of its devices with it. It can also be added to the Eve app. The Eve sensor, though, will not show up in the SmartThings app. No TBR. And the SmartThings hub cannot be added to the Eve app, because it is not a Matter Bridge. But if you added an Echo or Google device that was a TBR, voila! Now the Eve sensor can be discovered by ST as a Matter device. (You still won’t see the SmartThings hub and its devices in the Eve app, though.)

SCENARIO B: Smartthings V3 plus Hue plus Eve sensor

Say you had a V3 hub instead. The Hue integration works the same as Scenario A. But now the Eve sensor can also be added to SmartThings using Matter. You still won’t see the SmartThings hub and its devices in the Eve app, however. TBR, yes. Matter Bridge, no.

Did that help?

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AiDot is an app and cloud platform used by several of the smaller Chinese brands that for whatever reason didn’t want to go with Tuya. The only name I recognized immediately was Linkind.

Anyway, they are taking pre-orders on matter certified Wi-Fi, RGBW bulbs. About the same price as most off brand Wi-Fi bulbs in this device category, around $12 each, and they aren’t promising shipping until January. But other than Eve and the Hue hub it’s one of the first set of products you can actually order, if not get, right now.

Here’s the current non-matter version for comparison

Linkind already has a smartthings integration, but I’m not sure what models are included. Going to matter might let these run locally with an edge driver, though, which would be good… :sunglasses:

@Automated_House

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Meross released one of the first new Matter devices today. A smart plug which can be pre-ordered for $25/2 pack and ships end of the year. I’m not a big fan of the square form factor, though. They also said none of their existing products will get a Matter update, which is extremely annoying :confounded:

“The regular Wi-Fi and HomeKit products Meross have already released will not be able to integrate Matter by upgrading.”

Schlage also announced the $330 Schlage Encode Plus with Thread will not get a Matter update and instead they’ll release a new model :confounded:

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Agreed, but at least they’re doing something. Thanks for the update. :sunglasses:

Yeah I was worried they were going to do that. I’m eyeballing Matter devices to replace my three pre-Zwave Plus Connects. Looks like another year. :wink:

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I’m really liking our Yale Assure lock. It’s somewhat future proof since it has a plugin module that has the IoT radio. They’ve announced they will be making a Matter over Thread Module for it in the future.

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The reason it won’t be a Thread Border Router is because the SmartThings WiFi Hub mesh does not have a Thread radio. Anything that has a Wi-Fi radio + a Thread radio can theoretically become a Thread Border Router. See the diagram below. Because of these very minimal requirements, over time, Thread Border Routers will ship in much smaller, less expensive devices, primarily in devices on mains (e.g., constant) power.


The point is that your article is not accurate Thread Border Routers (TBRs) require the internet.

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A Thread Border Router is only for Thread devices and it only connects a Thread network to a Wi-Fi network. It’s not related to Matter Bridges, which are primarily for Z-Wave & Zigbee networks.

More simply,

Z-Wave, Zigbee, Wi-Fi: these require a central “hub” or “access point”; all devices end up connecting to this central point, whether it’s a Z-Wave Hub, a Zigbee Hub, or a Wi-Fi access point (aka a Wi-Fi router).

Thread: Thread devices don’t connect to any hubs or access points. Thread devices only connect to other Thread devices. So they create a Thread network. So how does a phone or a computer or any non-Thread device talk to the Thread network? The Thread network needs to have a Thread Border Router (which has both a Thread radio + a Wi-Fi radio); the TBR then connects all Thread devices to your local LAN (Wi-Fi & Ethernet). Now anything on your local home Wi-Fi or Ethernet network can talk to Thread devices (and vice-versa: Thread devices can now talk to Wi-Fi or Ethernet devices).

I see why it’s confusing between TBRs & Matter Bridges as they’re both connecting disparate networks that don’t talk to each other. But Thread Border Routers are much simpler, cheaper, and magnitudes higher volume (in # of devices) and they’re essentially required to use future Matter devices.

Thread Border Router: connects Thread network ←→ Wi-Fi & Ethernet network
Z-Wave Matter Bridge: connects Z-Wave network ←→ Matter network (Wi-Fi, Ethernet + Thread if you have a TBR)
Zigbee Matter Bridge: connects Zigbee network ←→ Matter network (Wi-Fi, Ethernet + Thread if you have a TBR)

None of these three need internet connectivity to make these connections. Because it doesn’t make sense: all these networks are local to begin with.

Samsung has claimed it’ll only do the first connection, connecting Thread networks to Wi-Fi & Ethernet networks. Samsung said they can’t / won’t do the 2nd & 3rd connections (Matter Bridges); they haven’t explained why, but it could be a technical reasons (acceptable) or a marketing reason (boo).

TP-Link recently announced their Wi-Fi 7 routers & access points. Two neat points:

  • The Deco app will become a certified Matter controller
  • All their Deco Wi-Fi 7 routers will be compatible with a future TP-Link Thread Matter USB dongle

This seems like the ‘end-game’ for Thread Border Routers; essentially everyone has a Wi-Fi router, so if the Thread Border Router is bundled in, you can get 100% coverage. Of course, people can add more Thread Border Routers for resiliency. IIRC, Thread supports up to 32 active Thread Border Routers in a single network (and ‘unlimited’ inactive Thread Border Routers).

And, the latency is probably a tiny bit better if the TBR is not just a device on the network that needs to hop over to the Wi-Fi access point, but the Wi-Fi access point itself.

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