Alternative Hubs

Hubitat also supports z-wave multicast or whatever it’s called that is the same (one command many devices changed).

I came back to read up and wanted to post that I am now 99% off ST and all factors of life are just better. I feel taller, I sit a bit straighter, and I don’t even need to load any dashboards or apps anymore because everything “Just Happens ™” or is commanded via Alexa. I’m not doing CRAZY amounts of stuff, but Node red has customized Inovelli color/alerts based on certain inputs, I am controlling “adaptive lighting” which is basically circadian rhythm on steroids (manual overrides, separate color/brightness/sleep modes, resets, etc.), and EVERYTHING is local that can be.

Scenes with 20+ devices execute in under 2 seconds, 100% of the time (I’ve literally not noted a failure yet), and the logging and state history charts are amazing for figuring out WHAT did WHAT to WHAT and when.

I just wanted to give some further feedback from a reasonably late adopter (bought hub in 2019) but someone who got fed up and decided to start from scratch.

Here’s to hoping ST can get it put back together, but it seems like it’s in pieces at the moment.

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Quick reply… Failure rate? One screwed up firmware. Which was rectified within a couple of hours. Aside from that? Nothing. Works ace. Wife loves it.

I bought a hubitat hub but I find some things are working better on SmartThings and other things are easier on hubitat. The HubConnect app allows you to control most devices on both hubs. So I can run automations on Hubitat for devices connected to SmartThings. The individual setup will tell what works better for you and can help reduce failure rate. (E.g. Older zwave devices don’t report status well on Hubitat; timed automations fail too frequently in Smartthings )

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Good to know. I am also a fairly recent adopter - maybe July 2019. Never thought that I would outgrow it so quickly.

Hopefully Hubitat has reached out to request permission to use that as their catch phrase and positioning statement. Rarely have 5 words better captured a desired outcome.

I am resigning myself to the idea that I may need to retain the Smartthings hub also. However, the linked services that initially caused me to download the app (Bond, Honeywell) would be fine without it.

I appreciate the inputs, and I also appreciate Smartthings being willing to host this type of discussion on the forum.

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I recently completed migrating from a ST version 2 hub to a Hubitat C-5 hub. My primary motivation for switching was to be as independent of the cloud as possible. I was also frustrated by the unreliability of timed events like shutting off a motion-activated light after a minute.

I first moved my Lutron Caseta light switches and Z-Wave fan switches over with no issues. Encouraged by this, I moved the rest of me devices over. For the most part everything is working as it should, with the exception of my Schlage Connect Z-Wave Plus smart locks. While they report status immediately when operated locally, I’m having a lot of difficulty sending commands to them from the HE hub. Clicking on the tile results in an hourglass icon which just stays stuck there; looking at the lock reveals the command was never executed. This happens even after I added an Aeotec 7 repeater midway between the hub and the locks. By contrast, ST never had any problems communicating with these locks even without a repeater.

I’ve also noticed that some devices don’t always update their status reliably. I had one contact sensor showing up as open when in fact it was closed; opening and closing the door triggered a status update. Another sensor stopped reporting its open/closed status entirely, even though it continued to report acceleration and 3-D motion data.

I never heard of HubConnect until reading this thread - it may just be the way to get the best of both worlds.

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As I sit at my desk, I see that my front lights completely skipped a “motion inactive for 3 minutes” automation. Back lights did the same last night. My mind is made up. Just a matter of having hubs in stock and a minor budget discussion.

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I have been walking around in the dark again. After 6 years and 120+ devices I’m getting a HE C-7 to move at least the Z-Wave over. Every few months all my Z-Wave device decide to add 10-30+ second delays before ON happens; no rhyme or reason. Lasts a few weeks and then everything start responding again.
I’ve tried everything except a spectrum analyser.

Could be drone interference. Seriously. :thinking: especially if there’s a fire department or other government agency that does a local survey every couple of months. (if it’s a neighbor’s drone, it will usually happen a lot more often.)

But if that’s it, you would see the same thing happen with the Hubitat.

And it’s more likely to be some kind of cloud artifact.

While I don’t discount that theory it would be low on the list. My neighbours are all of the aged variety and I know most of them; no drones. No drone sounds either. It happens all night and day 24/7 for long stretches. I do have a fire hall down the road but one would have to assume they have it powered on, not just charging, for weeks. I could query them, it’s a voulnteer station so only a few guys there.
As part of the Hubitat plan the devices being moved will be replaced with Plus so maybe the firmware will be more resiliant.
Thanks for the extra idea though.

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I had a few devices on the edge of my network in a detached garage that seemed to not work right a lot. It also seemed to interfere with all the devices and cause slow responses, even ones near the hub . I added a switch on the back porch between the house and garage and things are a lot faster across the whole zwave network.

When you do a zwave repair, do you get any errors? I was getting a lot but dont get any now with the new switch/repeater. I agree with @JDRoberts if its a zwave mesh issue you’ll have that with any hub you use. Also could be “ghost” devices. FAQ: How to remove ghost devices from your z-wave and zigbee networks

If it’s an interference issue, you’ll have that with any hub you use. Mesh issues are subject to platform idiosyncrasy, So may vary from hub to hub.

All my devices are online and I have done a repair but like many others (I think) it just spins forever until you cancel it; at least from the app.
I’ll try again from the IDE and see if it spits anything out.
I’m pretty sure it’s an external force as it can happen instantly, last for a week or 2 then instantly fine again.
Mix that with ST ups and down and sometime I never know what gives.
My first step is Z-Wave+ and local control.

This is getting OT so I’m starting a new thread or finding an old one for my Z-wave repair results examination.

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I have one final hesitation before migrating to Hubitat. Now that I have devices spread across a wide mesh, do I need to be proximate to the hub to add the devices? I have hardwired devices that are between 50ft and 200ft from my existing ST hub. Physically uninstalling and reinstalling each device would really take the luster off of having a shiny new toy.

Hubitat strongly encourages pairing devices in place and not moving device near hub to pair. If you cannot pair the device in place due to poor Z-Wave/Zigbee signal, then getting it to pair next to hub then moving it to its final resting place will result in a device that probably won’t work.

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If they are Z wave plus devices, you should be OK. Just start with the repeaters which are closest to the hub and work your way out from there. As long as each new device can reach a repeating device Already on the network, it can be added.

If they are Z wave classic devices, you may have an issue. If you bring them close to the hub and pair them, then move them back to the desired location, you will have to run the Z wave repair utility in order to get all the address tables updated. It should all straighten itself out in about 24 hours after you run the repair, but it’s more work.

The exception, as always, is zwave locks (any generation prior to S2) which have to be within “whisper distance“ of the hub in order to exchange the necessary security key.

For those, sometimes it’s easiest to Temporarily move the hub close to the lock, which you can do by using a Wi-Fi access point with an ethernet port on the side if your particular model hub doesn’t have Wi-Fi.

To be honest, I’m not sure if S2 locks require whisper distance anymore or not, my guess is not if you are adding them with a QR code But I don’t know for sure.

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Usually when you are moving from one hub to another the issue isn’t poor signal, it’s that you have a device which takes several hops to get to the hub. Signal strength along each hop is just fine. The issue is whether the device will accept being added through a repeater or not.

Z wave plus devices, with the exception of locks noted above, generally will, so they can be easily paired in place.

The problem is the older generations, which may require a direct connection to the hub to join the network for the first time. After that they will use repeaters. So for those, we sometimes had to use the method of bench pairing near the hub, then move it back to where it’s supposed to be, then do a Z wave repair so it knows what repeater to use.

Thanks @smn & @JDRoberts. This helps me to picture what the first few steps will look like. Many of my Z-Wave devices are older, non-plus tech. Still it is good to know what I am getting into and conceiving a mitigation strategy.

Update - pulled the trigger on one the Hubitat deals at @TheSmartestHouse. I chose the one that includes a Zooz Double Plug (basically free, with the 5% off code for writing a review for another product). That will help me to start upgrading to Z-Wave Plus at the same time. So, I will move any future questions over to the Hubitat community.

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Coming up strong


ST blue
Hubitat Orange

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